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Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by ActivePattern on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @12:12PM (#36972880)
As a Canadian, it does feel like stepping out of a time machine when you pay at restaurants in the USA. Instead of using a terminal at the table to pay yourself, you need to give the server your card and wait for them to manually process it somewhere. Maybe things have progressed in recent years. But we haven't done it that way in Canada since the early 2000's.
Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by danudey on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @12:29PM (#36973140)
I was visiting Seattle (from Vancouver) a few years ago, and they didn't want me to use my chip card as a chip card because if they did then I couldn't tip. What the heck is that all about?

Also, we're still hearing stories about merchants in the US starting to accept Apple Pay, whereas it worked fine in almost every retailer in Canada the day it was available - even though it wasn't available in Canada for a long time, American visitors (or Canadians with American credit cards) could use Apple Pay on launch day at any retailer that supported tap-to-pay, which was easily most of them.

Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by bmicraft on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @01:24PM (#36973923)
> What the heck is that all about?

Tax fraud? I've never seen a card reader in a restaurant (here in europe) where they couldn't either enter a completely arbitrary amount to pay, or add a tip.

Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by tptacek on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @01:32PM (#36974058)
That's not a thing. Americans universally pay for restaurant meals on cards.
Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by kasey_junk on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @02:02PM (#36974523)
It was probably an issue with that particular merchants POS. Merchants have very little incentive to update their POS systems so technology changes are very hard to get rolled out. Especially for smaller merchants which many restaurants are.

It’s a network effect thing. Because tap to pay wasn’t supported by the POS vendors US consumers did not get much improvement in experience because of it, so there wasn’t demand from merchants. With Apple Pay there is a huge improvement for consumers (not having to carry the credit card) it has finally forced merchants and their supporting POS vendors to support it.

Between that and the disruption in the POS market the iPad (and similar devices) brought, POS vendors have had to become more flexible.

Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by kalleboo on Thursday August 03, 2023 @02:22AM (#36982100)
Re: Apple Pay acceptance, some of the big chains took the chance to push hard for their own payment solutions ("Walmart Pay") in the hopes of not having to pay card processing fees anymore. Obviously the market has spoken and one by one they've been giving up.
Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by wpietri on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @12:20PM (#36973008)
Things have definitely changed here recently. At least in San Francisco, at-table terminals are now the norm in sit-down restaurants. Staff generally use the same device for order-taking and payment.
Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by baby_souffle on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @01:03PM (#36973617)
> Things have definitely changed here recently. At least in San Francisco, at-table terminals are now the norm in sit-down restaurants. Staff generally use the same device for order-taking and payment.

I used to work in PoS industry.

This tech is new-ish to the US but not to the rest of the first-world. 15 years ago, paying with a CC @ the table was common in Europe, but the terminal could ONLY do payments. The devices that have been rolling out to the US are more like android tablets in that they can run the order taking half of it, too. Selling hardware to a restaurant is tricky and "oh, no, this only allows you to move the payment portion to the table; staff still have to go to central spot to find a table that can accommodate guests and place their order" was basically a non-starter. The sales pitch is a lot easier now that everything can be done table-side.

Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by wpietri on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @05:42PM (#36978030)
For sure. "Bring the card to the device" and "bring the device to the card" seem about equivalent to me in convenience unless the device is something that the waitstaff is going to carry all the time anyhow.
Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by rconti on Thursday August 03, 2023 @02:06AM (#36982008)
Well, from the customer standpoint, it's one trip from the server versus two.
Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by nerdawson on Thursday August 03, 2023 @03:46AM (#36982629)
In one scenario, the waitstaff disappear with your credit card for an extended period of time. In the other, the card never leaves your sight.
Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by pests on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @12:57PM (#36973535)
I've started to see more and more servers using a mobile POS with built in credit reader and receipt printer. They hand it to you for tip and signature and you don't have to hand your card to anyone.
Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by WirelessGigabit on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @01:38PM (#36974153)
But now they get to see how much you're tipping them! Like they literally have to wait while you punch it in, increasing the social pressure to make up for a broken system.

I don't go to restaurants anymore. Too much pressure.

Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by DiggyJohnson on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @02:44PM (#36975156)
Respectfully, this seems like social anxiety or hyperbole. You don't go to restaurants because of the stress of the cultural norm of tipping? Seems more accurate to say you don't like eating out in general or because of the price of eating out once you factor in a tip...
Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by tlogan on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @03:30PM (#36975933)
Definetly not a better experience for all consumers. Or waiter.

I do know that some restaurant owners are removing these things. They do not want to look like Olive Garden :)

But it really depends on a restaurant: is it high end, type of food / drinks, it is a date place, etc.

Majority of restaurant is all about experience and event payment system should match that experience.

Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by sigwinch28 on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @05:34PM (#36977908)
> Majority of restaurant is all about experience and event payment system should match that experience.

I'm in the UK. I go to many high-end restaurants, cocktail bars, etc. Portable card terminals are essentially universal in these places. The fact it's the same everywhere is a feature, not a bug.

It's quick. Your card never leaves your sight. No pen is required. Payments up to £100 can be done using contactless on a physical card. Even higher amounts with smartphones/smart watches. Tipping is often integrated into the terminal where tipping is common. It's rare to have to put the card into the terminal.

I don't think it detracts from the experience. On the contrary, I think it streamlines the bit between being finished and wanting to leave:

"Please can I have the bill and a card machine, please".

Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by nerdawson on Wednesday August 02, 2023 @10:31PM (#36980673)
I’d be annoyed if I ended up in a restaurant that didn’t have a card machine.

They’re almost universal at this point to the extent that not to have one would be unusual.

Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by pests on Thursday August 03, 2023 @01:17PM (#36988779)
> almost universal at this point

Where you live maybe.

Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by kalleboo on Thursday August 03, 2023 @02:34AM (#36982153)
I've lived in Japan for so long now that paying at restaurants in other countries where it's done at the table seems so awkward.

In Japan, you don't pay at the table, you get up when leaving and pay at the exit. If you're at a high-end establishment entertaining guests, this also leaves you the opportunity to "go to the restroom" late in the dinner and pay ahead of time so that the "mess" of payments is completely forgotten.

It also means waiters don't need to run around the place with cards/readers/cash, you don't need to fumble when you left your wallet in your coat that's been hung up, don't need to squint to read receipts in the dim mood lighting in the eating area, etc etc.

Re:How I discovered the underground world of credit card net... by pests on Thursday August 03, 2023 @01:16PM (#36988759)
> In Japan, you don't pay at the table, you get up when leaving and pay at the exit.

Some (well, one maybe) restaurants near me are like this but it is uncommon. Ram's Horn comes to mind.