News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by harpratap on Monday July 31, 2023 @01:16PM (#36945806)
The dead thing is Intel (x86) and the successor is AMD (x86) as opposed to ARM in our case. Isn't it correct?
Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by re-thc on Monday July 31, 2023 @01:35PM (#36946087)
> Isn't it correct?

No. Intel isn't dead. They may be behind (for now) but they're definitely catching up and have in a way on the desktop.

It's not certain that Intel will die and AMD will for sure win. Competition is great.

Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by saghm on Monday July 31, 2023 @01:43PM (#36946199)
If we're going to be that pedantic, we might as well just say that because Intel and AMD aren't living entities so they can't be "dead". Or we could just accept that the original meaning of the phrase has evolved and is flexible enough to be used in situations where it's not absolutely literal.
Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by Teever on Monday July 31, 2023 @01:55PM (#36946374)
I just closed another post on HN because the top thread descended into some bullshit semantics pissing contest so I come here and see the same.

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed an increase in arguing over the meaning of words on HN lately?

Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by arcanemachiner on Monday July 31, 2023 @02:39PM (#36946982)
Nerds have been arguing online about irrelevant pedantry as long as the Internet has been around. And this place attracts some pretty hardcore nerds.
Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by kergonath on Monday July 31, 2023 @02:05PM (#36946495)
I’ve noticed that as well. It beggars belief that people are seriously arguing about applying a centuries-old foreign metaphors about kings to modern large corporations. That’s straight over Pedantic territory into the Obnoxious Contrarian wilderness. Sigh…
Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by coldtea on Monday July 31, 2023 @04:14PM (#36948134)
Sorry, but you've just noticed it?

Wars about semantics have been standard fare on geekdom since the dawn of time, and on Hacker News since the dawn of Arc.

What appears as "Obnoxious Contrarian wilderness" is good-old hacker "well, actually" pendanticness (with some sprinkling of on-the-spectrum focus on details and semantics).

Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by kergonath on Monday July 31, 2023 @05:50PM (#36949354)
> Sorry, but you've just noticed it?

Yes, I have noticed “an increase in arguing over the meaning of words on HN lately”. I also know how to discuss the meaning of words and how they form the context of a conversation, once taken together.

> Wars about semantics have been standard fare on geekdom since the dawn of time, and on Hacker News since the dawn of Arc.

Sure, and I enjoy very much some pedantry (and am not above doing my bit every now and then), but that’s not the point. If someone wants to have a heated discussion about how a centuries-old metaphor would apply to the kings of France but not to a multinational company, then sure, have at it, as long as you don’t derail otherwise useful threads. I will just opt out of spending my time that way and instead get some interesting pedantry.

I must admit I am not really sure what image you want to imply by “dawn of Arc”, though it does go a bit with the French king vibe. Would you care to explicit a little?

> What appears as "Obnoxious Contrarian wilderness" is good-old hacker "well, actually" pendanticness (with some sprinkling of on-the-spectrum focus on details and semantics).

Pedantry and semantics are fine, and indeed one of the reasons why I am here. But the point beyond that has to be knowledge and enlightenment, otherwise it’s just, yes, obnoxious. There is also a thin line between a good “well actually” and a nuisance (not even talking about bad faith trolling).

Please note that I did not address any of the people in question, because that would be stupid, rude, and counter-productive. I am happy if they have their arguments on their side. I was just replying to a fellow commenter that they were not alone with that feeling. There’s no need to be rude about it.

Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by coldtea on Monday July 31, 2023 @06:28PM (#36949736)
>There’s no need to be rude about it.

I'm sorry, then! (Was I tho? I thought I answered mostly matter-of-factly)

Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by dragonwriter on Monday July 31, 2023 @05:53PM (#36949405)
> I must admit I am not really sure what image you want to imply by “dawn of Arc”

Arc is a Lisp dialect invented by PG whose main notable use is that it is the implementation language for HN: the “dawn of Arc” is thus a flowery way of saying something like “the first concrete steps to the creation of HN”.

Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by kergonath on Monday July 31, 2023 @06:06PM (#36949533)
Interesting, I did not know that. Thanks!
Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by lcnPylGDnU4H9OF on Monday July 31, 2023 @02:04PM (#36946483)
I'd guess it's a timing thing. This site likes to prioritize more highly the "current" discussions which are generating upvotes as long as they're not also generating a ton of downvotes.
Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by coldtea on Monday July 31, 2023 @04:11PM (#36948102)
>Is it just me or has anyone else noticed an increase in arguing over the meaning of words on HN lately?

Depends on what you mean by increase, arguing, and words.

Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by throwaway742 on Monday July 31, 2023 @05:16PM (#36948948)
It's unironically one of the things I like about this site.
Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by Clamchop on Monday July 31, 2023 @01:49PM (#36946283)
Weird. The topic was the phrase.

Mercari replaced Intel with AMD. One x86 out, another in. Usage is correct if figurative.

Article does not claim Intel is dead. States that they are "catching up". But for their nodes, Intel out ("dead"), AMD in.

It's reasonable.

Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by GauntletWizard on Monday July 31, 2023 @04:02PM (#36947999)
Perhaps it would be better phrased as "'intel x86'" vs "'AMD x86-64'". Specific sets of mandatory instructions and extension parameters - But AMD's set "won" at some point in the past, roughly corresponding to the launch of Intel's "Core" microarchitecture in 2006 when they started competing in the x86 space again
Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by coldtea on Monday July 31, 2023 @04:10PM (#36948092)
Your point is about the factual statement (whether Intel x86 is actually dead).

But this subthread, and the parent's question was more about whether the idiomatic usage of "(old) X is dead, long live (new) X" was correct (given that the author believes AMD taking over Intel is the factual case). That is, not about whether the factual statement is correct or not, just whether it's expressed well idiomatically.

Re:x86 is dead, long live x86 by pjmlp on Tuesday August 01, 2023 @03:27AM (#36953348)
If we forget about the Intel patents AMD also needs to produce their own x86 flavour.