Messages that can only be understood under the influence of psychedelics

Re:Messages that can only be understood under the influence ... by nbardy on Tuesday June 06, 2023 @12:00PM (#36214808)

You admit that there is plenty of recreational and therapeutical use for them and then that leads you to the conclusion that they’re not spiritual gateways. I find this surprising as those are one in the same to me.

Spiritual experiences have been about recreation, understanding others, the self, personal growth, coming of age, etc…

I feel like your post in general is full of acknowledgment of these drugs capabilities followed by attempts to downplay it with pejoratives like “chemical glitching” or “lower dimension”. It’s quiet confusing that you seem to think positively of the drugs but then dunk on them in the same breath.

I don’t think being able to explain, categorize and describe phenomena needs to make them less significant or impact. The mechanism of action being non mystical doesn’t need to change the significance of the experience.

This reminds me of a quote from Margaret Boden about her work on understanding creativity in a academic context.

> A scientific understanding of creativity does not destroy our wonder at it, nor does it make creative ideas predictable. Demystification does not imply dehumanization.

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Re:Messages that can only be understood under the influence ... by drdeca on Tuesday June 06, 2023 @12:16PM (#36215051)

I don’t think “lower dimension” is a pejorative, just, contrasting with the “higher dimension” claim. Like, just literally a lower dimensionality (on account of the fractal dimension, where the metric dimension is less than the (integer) topological dimension)

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Re:Messages that can only be understood under the influence ... by falling_ on Tuesday June 06, 2023 @12:39PM (#36215460)

LSD also seems to lead to extradimensional bypass

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Re:Messages that can only be understood under the influence ... by drdeca on Tuesday June 06, 2023 @04:49PM (#36218940)

Is this a hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy reference / joke ? About how they destroy the earth in order to make a travel route?

If not, what do you mean?

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Re:Messages that can only be understood under the influence ... by roqi on Tuesday June 06, 2023 @12:48PM (#36215623)

> (...) leads you to the conclusion that they’re not spiritual gateways. I find this surprising as those are one in the same to me.

How does that surprise you? I mean do spiritual gateways exist at all? Is there even a concrete definition and concept? Or are they just a conjecture without any basis whatsoever?

It seems you start from baseless beliefs and blindly assume they are require no validation and afterwards feel surprised others don't share your wild assumptions.

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Re:Messages that can only be understood under the influence ... by nbardy on Wednesday June 07, 2023 @01:12PM (#36229828)

My definition would be that spiritual gateways are tools that help you have spiritual experience.

Plenty of people have had that shared effect from psychedelics.

I’m sure what baseless belief you see.

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Re:Messages that can only be understood under the influence ... by idiotsecant on Tuesday June 06, 2023 @12:55PM (#36215730)

Would you describe the biochemical mechanisms behind aspirin as 'spiritual'? Why or why not?

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