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Re:My friends who cheated in interviews are getting promoted by bumby on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @11:40AM (#35888961)
>Like, there was a time where this kind of personality type would just go get an MBA

One nuance that may help explain how the change happened is how the status of CS has changed in the last 20 years. Maybe its just my age bias, but there seems to be a perceptible change of how CS majors are viewed by society and that changes the type of people attracted to that curriculum.

It used to be that CS and engineering majors were the nerds who, as you say, "simply thought making stuff was cool." Nowadays, though, as CS commands a disproportionately large salary and has a higher status marker. This tends to attract more people who are in it the reasons of status and money, rather than for a fascination with the work. Anecdotally, when I ask people why they got into CS a surprising number now say something along the lines of "because it pays well."

It's my opinion that change in perspective can bias how one views cheating. If the curriculum is just a means to an end (i.e., if school is just a means to a degree, which is just a gateway to a job/paycheck), it seems to make cheating more palatable.

Re:My friends who cheated in interviews are getting promoted by JohnFen on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @11:53AM (#35889151)
> Anecdotally, when I ask people why they got into CS a surprising number now say something along the lines of "because it pays well."

Yeah, I've noticed that too. It's utterly depressing.

Re:My friends who cheated in interviews are getting promoted by asimpletune on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @12:04PM (#35889353)
I don't know the history of the bar exam, but I could imagine something like that one day being instituted to protect our repetitional interest.

Even though we're both talking about SWE, whereas CS is a different thing altogether.

Re:My friends who cheated in interviews are getting promoted by bumby on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @12:53PM (#35890021)
NCEES has tried to create a Professional Engineer license related to CS. It died out from a lack of interest.
Re:My friends who cheated in interviews are getting promoted by randcraw on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @12:20PM (#35889554)
I think computing in the 1980s was a very different enterprise than it is today. Back then it was about exploring a new world whose horizons were expanding fast, as processor speed and O/S capability grew seemingly without bound. IMHO it was the transition of the cutting edge away from technical to social after the web arose that changed the tenor of computing. Devices became secondary to connected apps, and the focus among the players shifted from love of innovative hacks to fascination for megabuck payouts, meanwhile 'coolness' described _using_ computers rather than making them dance.
Re:My friends who cheated in interviews are getting promoted by danaris on Thursday May 11, 2023 @12:23PM (#35904442)
Despite how it often feels, "20 years ago" wasn't the 1980s.
Re:My friends who cheated in interviews are getting promoted by bradlys on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @01:45PM (#35890747)
If you want people to take on jobs purely for non-socioeconomic reasons then you might need to fix the underlying socioeconomic problems. (e.g. cost of housing)

I don't see any real movement from older generations to do anything about that. They just keep complaining about the youth chasing money instead of some "passion." (Which ignores that the material conditions have completely changed in the last 20 years)

Re:My friends who cheated in interviews are getting promoted by bumby on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @02:04PM (#35891026)
I don’t think this dichotomous thinking accurately captures the nuance and may just show a personal (and understandable) axe to grind. It’s definitely not an either-or choice.

Somebody can still quite easily work in CS and find affordable and high quality living. But maybe not in SV. I’d even argue you can work on more interesting problems. But people overwhelmingly want to work in SV because of the status it confers.

Re:My friends who cheated in interviews are getting promoted by wanttocomment on Wednesday May 10, 2023 @07:55PM (#35895291)
I think the shift we have seen is from high status/upper classes suddenly taking an interest in CS.

Not lower class people moving into middle class.