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Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by logicchains on Saturday May 06, 2023 @10:44AM (#35841850)
>I wonder if the editor read "1984" and straight up copied its ideas

Maybe George Orwell copied the idea from Esperanto. For instance, "dark" in Esperanto is "notlight", and left is "notright".

Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by robswc on Saturday May 06, 2023 @11:12AM (#35842126)
I can get behind the "notlight" but "notright"... feels like something my brain would never get used to haha.
Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by Izkata on Saturday May 06, 2023 @01:59PM (#35843748)
Because based on the words it's composed of, it's different from "left" - it would include "forward" and "backward".

Similarly for "notlight" implying including twilight, which "dark" does not.

Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by robocat on Saturday May 06, 2023 @04:05PM (#35844920)
> twilight

Perhaps that is lightandnotlight. We almost have notlight in English: unlit. An unlit room feels twilighty to me.

> notright

Left in Esperanto: maldekstra

I can’t imagine why a language designer would choose “mal” as the prefix for “not”. In English and Spanish (two common languages), mal has some bad connotations (malodour, malady, malfeasance, malo, malformed). Let’s try the opposite: “not left” is definitely something different from “right” - urrrgggh. “Do not go left” doesn’t mean to go right.

However it looks like Esperanto also has “liva”. Turnu liven tuj post la angulo ~= Turn left immediately after the corner.

Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by Izkata on Saturday May 06, 2023 @04:39PM (#35845179)
> I can’t imagine why a language designer would choose “mal” as the prefix for “not”. In English and Spanish (two common languages), mal has some bad connotations (malodour, malady, malfeasance, malo, malformed).

Well, there's also the Latin word "sinister" which has a very different meaning in English... Kinda seems like a common theme.

Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by robocat on Saturday May 06, 2023 @05:58PM (#35845702)
Literally see maladroit
Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by malicka on Saturday May 06, 2023 @07:16PM (#35846242)
> Let’s try the opposite: “not left” is definitely something different from “right” - urrrgggh. “Do not go left” doesn’t mean to go right.

“maldekstra” doesn't actually mean “not right” — mal in Esperanto more precisely means “opposite.” Left is opposite of right, and so malmaldekstra (opposite of the opposite of right) is still right (dekstra).

“Not right” in Esperanto doesn't exactly mean left, either, just like in in English. That'd be ne + dekstra = nedesktra.

Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by robocat on Sunday May 07, 2023 @07:39PM (#35856652)
Sure. It just feels like a malicious choice for left. No soy maleducado. !Tengo mucho mano izquirdo, y es derecho mio a decir la palabra “maldekstra” es «malappropriate»¡

http://www.anmal.uma.es/Numero9/Forment.htm

  Joan Bastardas habla de la extrañeza de la existencia de la palabra ensinistrar del catalán, puesto que tiene un significado claramente positivo a pesar de ser derivado de siniestro-a. «... ensinistrar que no deixa de sorprendre els qui s´acosten al català des d´altres llengües romàniques, en què les idees d´habilitat i aptesa s´associen amb la mà dreta i no amb la mà esquerra, el castellà adiestrar, l´italià addestrare; en francès hi ha dexterité, però també en català hi ha destresa i destre-a 'hàbil', 'expert', i també maldestre, com el francès maladroit». (Bastardas 1996: 26)

  la contraposición entre la bondad y la justicia — simbolizados por la derecha — y la maldad, el egoísmo —relacionados con la izquierda—.
Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by taejo on Monday May 08, 2023 @06:14AM (#35859944)
> However it looks like Esperanto also has “liva”. Turnu liven tuj post la angulo ~= Turn left immediately after the corner.

If you wanted to be understood, it'd be better to say maldekstren though. I'd never heard of liv-, English Wiktionary lists it as "neologism, nonstandard" and Reta Vortaro as "malofte" (infrequent).

Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by thomastjeffery on Saturday May 06, 2023 @09:29PM (#35846993)
The word "notright" is as clear of an example as you can get: does it mean straight or left? Up?

The most confoundingly powerful feature of language is ambiguity: on one hand, you can't take it literally; on the other hand, you don't have to.

Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by joseda-hg on Sunday May 07, 2023 @10:19AM (#35851814)
I think the example doesn't quite do it justice, a better interpretation would be antiright, which would be unambiguous
Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by TrapLord_Rhodo on Sunday May 07, 2023 @03:00PM (#35854469)
in orwellian newspeak, the whole point is to be ambigious so you can't point at harm.
Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by bdg on Monday May 08, 2023 @02:58AM (#35858870)
If you like that you're gonna love TokiPona. So few words that even basic objects might take a paragraph to explain.
Re:Wikipedia users edits over 90k uses of “comprised of” by taejo on Monday May 08, 2023 @06:10AM (#35859919)
Esperanto dekstra only means right, the direction/side, though, and so maldekstra only means left, the direction/side.