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Re: by AtlasBarfed on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @11:04AM (#35803248)
I remember this as one of the computer languages you would list to make it seem like you knew a lot about computer languages.

... in the 1980s ...

Of course nobody actually knew or used it.

Re: by geophile on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @11:20AM (#35803449)
This is just completely wrong.

I learned and used SNOBOL for RBK Dewar's compiler classes at NYU, 78-79. (Dewar was one of the authors of SPITBOL, an implementation of the language).

Because of this, experience, a couple of years later, in grad school elsewhere, I was able to help someone in the computing center debug a client's SNOBOL program.

Sure, this wasn't a huge insurance company writing their payroll system, but SNOBOL was a real language. But ignoring that: SNOBOL was a completely unique language, beautiful in its own way. It looked like a very sparse form of assembler language. Control flow was bizarre: a statement could "succeed" or "fail", and a statement could specify goto targets for either, both, or none of these cases. (I don't know the exact dates, but SNOBOL must have been designed around the same time as the famous "Goto considered harmful" letter.)

As a measure of how good the language was: SNOBOL is famously based on the idea of string pattern matching. I found SNOBOL completely intuitive and easy to use. By contrast, I find UNIX regular expressions incomprehensible, and they send me to RTFM each time I use them. I have a similar view of Perl. Ugly and unintuitive, the exact opposite of SNOBOL.

Also, I would like to recommend the Griswold, Poage, and Polonski book on SNOBOL4. I remember it as a truly excellent language book, on the level of K&R.

Re: by codeulike on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @11:37AM (#35803700)
Seems like you know a lot about computer languages
Re: by geophile on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @03:08PM (#35806422)
I assume that you are attempting sarcasm here, but I'm missing your point.
Re: by 1n3nt0r on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @12:30PM (#35804369)
Nice to hear mention of RBK Dewar. He was well known in the programming languages field as a professor at NYU, but also was quite successful as an entrepreneur with his various compilers (I think his company was called "Realia").

I took one of his classes as an undergraduate at NYU, but used SNOBOL, SETL, and some other early languages as part of a young scholars high school program at NYU in the early 80s.

Re: by geophile on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @03:07PM (#35806408)
I remember SETL, and it made a huge impression on me -- just the idea of sets as a primitive datatype. I remember one lecture on using SETL to specify language optimizations, which were set-oriented.

Also, that experience primed me for appreciating the relational model, and relational algebra, and I went on to specialize in DBMSs.

Re: by pavlov on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @11:22AM (#35803486)
Imagining some 1980s Hacker News clickbait #1 headlines:

  - Towers of Hanoi in SNOBOL
  - It's true: Ada on CP/M
  - Discover your inner extrovert with Smalltalk-80
  - In the '90s everything will be in Eiffel
  - How to ace your next Modula-2 interview
Re: by marcodiego on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @11:36AM (#35803693)
I think "Towers of Hanoi in SNOBOL" would get to first page even today.
Re: by tpmx on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @11:51AM (#35803854)
https://raganwald.com/assets/snobol-green-book.pdf

"4.6.4 Example - Tower of Hanoi" on pages 109-111 (the scanned page numbers)

Re: by pavlov on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @12:04PM (#35804055)
Is it even a 1980s programming language without a Hanoi example?

Here's the program in its all-caps, weirdly indented beauty:

         DEFINE('HANOI(N,NS,ND,NI)')       :(HANOI.END)
  HANOI  EQ(N,O)                           :S(RETURN)
         HANOI(N - 1,NS,NI,ND)
         OUTPUT 'MOVE DISC  ' N '  FROM ' NS ' TO ' ND
         HANOI(N - 1,NI,ND,NS)             :(RETURN)
  HANOI.END
  TEST   HANOI (5,'A','C','B')
  END
Re: by greenyoda on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @03:02PM (#35806332)
Actually, SNOBOL is a 1960s programming language[1], so it wouldn't have been a trendy new language in an 80s version of HN.

In the 1960s, most programming was done on punched cards, and keypunch machines (and many computers) didn't have lower case letters on them. Hence, languages from that era, like FORTRAN, COBOL, PL/I, LISP and assembly language, were written in all-caps.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SNOBOL

Re: by abecedarius on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @12:04PM (#35804047)
Heh. I got into computing in the 80s, and your other headlines are much more plausible. I did find a very interesting library book Algorithms in SNOBOL4 by Gimpel, so I actually got familiar with it -- but that was sheer luck.

(The book's title is misleading now: it doesn't much overlap a modern undergrad intro to algorithms. It's more "here are examples and techniques of programming in SNOBOL".)

Re: by mountainofdeath on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @11:11AM (#35803344)
True. I had a professor mention SNOBOL a few times in lectures. The same professor only taught classes in Scheme, including CS 101 and Software Engineering. The man was stuck in the 80s in every way.
Re: by cafard on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @11:49AM (#35803834)
I took a class on programming languages from Douglas Maurer, who had written a book on SNOBOL. It was out of print, which saved a few dollars for the students, since he provided photocopies. SNOBOL did not look especially practical, but the built-in pattern matching made Awk and Perl that much easier to learn.

(Maurer also composes or composed music. His madrigal "Forty Bucks" set to music the text of a Montgomery County, Maryland, photo enforcement ticket.)

Re: by rootbear on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @12:10PM (#35804121)
Thank you! I took a programming languages survey course when getting my Masters at GWU in the early 90s. It was taught by Dr. Maurer. I couldn’t remember his name, but I did remember that he was into SNOBOL. I really need to find his “Forty Bucks” madrigal.
Re: by cafard on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @02:17PM (#35805776)
It was performed by an amateur theatre group called "The Hexagon Club", at a show maybe a dozen years ago. I've searched on-line without luck--it probably doesn't help that Tom T. Hall wrote a song called "The Ballad of Forty Dollars". Anyway, good luck.

We quite possibly crossed paths at GWU back then.

Re: by RHSeeger on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @12:03PM (#35804029)
SNOBOL was the first language I learned with pattern matching. It was, at least to my memory, pretty much the main interesting feature of the language.
Re: by RHSeeger on Wednesday May 03, 2023 @12:01PM (#35804004)
I learned SNOBOL in college, back in the early 90s. Admittedly, it was a course about computer languages in general, not SNOBOL in particular.