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Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by zamalek on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @07:22PM (#35365353)
The problem is that anyone with sufficient money could rent out the infrastructure required to train GPT5 or what-have-you. They need not share it publicly, they can use it for their nefarious purposes privately.

The analogous scenario would be preventing your military from experimenting with TNT, when the recipe for TNT is public knowledge. You can't copyright away public knowledge.

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by jongjong on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @07:45PM (#35365599)
Good point. As always, it's always the good guys who follow the rules and the bad guys who don't. This pause would just allow the bad guys to catch up.

The solution is to allow as many different entities as possible to develop their own AIs so that they end up competing with each other and providing alternatives. What we don't want is a single AI which dominates our entire belief system.

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by amelius on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @08:10PM (#35365844)
It's wishful thinking that the good uses of tech and the bad uses of tech will always result in a net zero or good outcome.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by Zuiii on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @09:59PM (#35366794)
Sure but it wont be completely one-sided.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by endtime on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @09:08PM (#35366347)
Ah yes the old "give everyone in the world their own nuclear weapon" solution.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by Zuiii on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @10:02PM (#35366812)
Seeing the geopolitical condition of those who have them and those who don't, I can't say that idea is without merit.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by endtime on Thursday March 30, 2023 @03:17PM (#35377619)
I meant every individual person, not every country.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by RUN12 on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @10:03PM (#35366820)
What, exactly, do you think would happen if western nations didn't have nuclear weapons?
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by endtime on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @11:28PM (#35367541)
What, exactly, do you think would happen if you reread my comment a little more carefully?
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by rdiddly on Thursday March 30, 2023 @02:17AM (#35368768)
There's not that much to it brah.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by detrites on Thursday March 30, 2023 @03:02AM (#35369094)
This is a really strained analogy. Nuclear bombs only have one - tremendously negative thing - they do, other than the one positive of the fact it's so negative nobody uses them, to avoid the same repercussions.

AI on the other hand has a wide range of extremely positive applications, some of which have such tremendous life-saving potential it's almost ridiculous. Many, or most of which, likely might never be achieved without AI.

The analogy is as ridiculous to me as calling personal computers in the 80's nuclear bombs because they could be used to hack and shut down the power grid. Yes, they could. And I'm sure some were scared of the prospect then, too.

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by sensanaty on Thursday March 30, 2023 @06:19AM (#35370461)
What "extremely positive applications" does ChatGPT have, exactly? From where I'm standing all I see is an infinitely deep and vast ocean of pure spam, scams and data harvesting on a never-before seen scale where megacorps like Micro$oft hoover up any and all data that they can, meaning we do all the hard work while M$ and similar corpos get to sell our own work back to us at a premium.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by detrites on Thursday March 30, 2023 @06:46AM (#35370688)
ChatGPT isn't the be-all of AI advancements. However, a model that can coherently understand and explain advanced topics to people in a tailored way, has huge educational benefits. Proper education is the core of every issue we face.

A subtler aspect of this is the potential for cheap, tailored counselling. A few iterations and it will no doubt be possible to enhance the mental well-being of those without prior access, for comparatively little cost.

Those benefits again extend into every area, crime and poverty being rooted both in lack of education and lack of social and emotional support.

The social acceptance of chatting with an AI is important in this as it gets people over that mental hurdle. Localising chats so they are not subject to privacy concerns also advances benefits such as these.

There's positive benefits to be found everywhere with AI, but they won't be if we don't envisage, look for, and develop them. And they need to be found for balance, as it remains true there are many potential negatives.

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by kajaktum on Thursday March 30, 2023 @09:32AM (#35372418)
This is a very naive take. Out best psychologists aren’t using their expertise to solve mental health but to hack them. What makes you think people will use LLMs for good? It’s far more profitable to do bad with it.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by detrites on Thursday March 30, 2023 @11:53AM (#35374684)
Our best psychologists cost significant money, and there are a limited number of them (effect and cause). Whereas no motive of profit is necessary to affect the changes I've described, that's the entire point and benefit here.

Any single not-for-profit social health organisation, of which there are a huge number, could use a tiny part of their funding to fine-tune an LLM on counselling resources and case transcripts. It'd cost little, and only need to be done once.

The major hurdle here, again, is education. Once such organisations realise how much more easily they can reach their goals using AI, they'll jump on it. The final obstacle is then social acceptance of AI assistance (growing now).

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by sensanaty on Thursday March 30, 2023 @11:28AM (#35374219)
Sorry, but all of this strikes me as a very naive take on where AI is headed. The only reality I can see happening is that it just gets used to peddle even more ads to people while harvesting every single scrap of data possible on everyone while replacing large swathes of the population with cheap labor for the ruling classes.

This utopia you envision where we use AI for anything remotely good sure would be nice, but with the way the world and the people pushing for this AI especially work there just isn't a chance in hell that's how it's gonna end up going.

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by studentik on Thursday March 30, 2023 @11:32AM (#35374316)
The only thing that can balance AI-man is AI-woman
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by idrios on Thursday March 30, 2023 @06:48AM (#35370696)
ChatGPT is a better Google. Instead of finding a page that matches your query, it can interpret the results of multiple pages and output a response that's more tailored to your exact prompt. The only downside to this is that ChatGPT becomes your primary source instead of the page(s) it sources content from, so you can't verify it's authenticity.

But the "extremely positive applications" to ChatGPT are, at the very least, the same positive applications of any other search engine.

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by endtime on Thursday March 30, 2023 @03:19PM (#35377641)
I think you are missing some nuance what people are concerned about and why. This article spells it out pretty clearly, I think: https://time.com/6266923/ai-eliezer-yudkowsky-open-letter-no...

I agree that comparing nukes to superhuman AGI is an imperfect analogy, because nukes don't have goals.

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by zamalek on Thursday March 30, 2023 @07:41PM (#35380395)
Nukes do have goals, they share the goals of those who launch them. What I am afraid of not AI, rather I am afraid of what AI is forced to do.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by detrites on Friday March 31, 2023 @09:33AM (#35386925)
I can't locate any nuance in that article. Hyperbole, panic and many unfounded assumptions serving those first two, easy.

Good for clicks and getting an extremely manipulatable public coming back for more, I guess.

Historically, whenever we have created new technology that is amazing and impactful but that all of the positives/negatives are not fully understood, it's worked out fine. If we want to be scientific about it, that's our observable knowledge here.

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by IanCal on Thursday March 30, 2023 @08:46AM (#35371789)
Restricting access to nuclear weapons is feasible, because of how hard they are to make on a larger scale, and even then it's very difficult. They are significant projects for entire nation states to undertake.

Training a LLM is something random companies with some cash and servers are doing.

So the outcome of "pretty much only we have nukes" is an option. I don't think that's a realistic proposal for AI. Given that, is the outcome of "more trustworthy people stop, others continue" a good one?

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by politician on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @09:43PM (#35366661)
You already need authorization to rent A100s from cloud providers. There are, at most, four entities to control post-CHIPS act: Amazon, Microsoft, Google, and NVIDIA.

Good news, they’re all American companies.

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by zamalek on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @10:23PM (#35367030)
A100s aren't magical pixie dust. China aren't developing their own silicon[1] for funsies.

This is all mathematics. Ignoring the fact that the entirety of what is required to build GPT-4 is easily remembered by a single human being (i.e. adversary), it could also be rediscovered. America doesn't have some secret sauce that nobody else has. We have a time lead, and that is it.

Keeping the details secret and under control is like trying to keep anyone from discovering that the sky is blue.

A 6 months freeze on AI research in America? China would relish it. Hell, who's to say this isn't their idea?

[1]: https://www.tomshardware.com/news/moore-threads-unveils-chun...

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by antonvs on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @11:27PM (#35367527)
It reminds me of the crypto restrictions in the 90s. That just led to a few people outside the US becoming wealthy by selling tech unfettered by US crypto restrictions, like Mark Shuttleworth, now of Canonical/Ubuntu fame.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by wincy on Wednesday March 29, 2023 @11:30PM (#35367553)
You can buy an A100 on eBay right now. If I had a few hundred grand I could have an A100 x8 box delivered to my house tomorrow.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by luxcem on Thursday March 30, 2023 @05:02AM (#35369915)
You could probably run a model but not train a new one, especially one bigger than GPT-4. You'd need ten of thousand of A100 as a rough estimate.
Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by bob1029 on Thursday March 30, 2023 @01:57PM (#35376655)
I suspect some of us are going to be really disappointed when the actual parameter count for GPT-4 is discovered.

Has anyone considered the opposite possibility around the closed nature of OpenAI's work? I.e. Instead of worrying that someone will reproduce their 10k+ GPU GPT-4 training super farm, maybe the opposite happened - They discovered a way to increase performance while simultaneously reducing the required parameter counts and/or hardware.

Would that realization be more or less dangerous with this A100 constraint in mind?

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by esperent on Friday March 31, 2023 @12:17AM (#35382494)
> They discovered a way to increase performance while simultaneously reducing the required parameter counts and/or hardware.

In that case, why would they be so severely limiting access? If GPT4 was cheaper to run and better, surely they would have immediately transitioned away from 3.5?

Re:Pause Giant AI Experiments: An Open Letter by politician on Friday March 31, 2023 @12:33AM (#35382604)
(1) Some people speculate that GPT-4 is actually an ensemble of models selected by a supervisory model based on response timings.

(2) GPT4All is using improved training data with LoRA and GPT-J to build something that competes with GPT-4 at a fraction of the size and parameter count.

(3) The emergence of new capabilities strongly corresponds to parameter count. Transformers with 6.7B parameters are apparently where the first such emergence occurs associated with a global structural change in the hidden layers (the so-called “phase change”). There will be a strong incentive to train larger models to identify additional capabilities.

The first and second observations imply that federal regulation of A100-class GPUs would be ineffective. However, the third observation suggests that it would be highly effective at preventing untrusted parties from discovering novel and potentially more disruptive capabilities.