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Re:GPT-4 by swyx on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:03PM (#35154647)
contrarian view - they are actually pretty open. sharing GPT, CLIP, Whisper, and high level details of alphastar, dalle, and others.

they're just not open source. they never called themselves OpenSourceAI. people get an inch of openness and expect the doors wide open and i think that is unfairly hostile.

Re:GPT-4 by 4gotunameagain on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:10PM (#35154763)
A quote from Introducing OpenAI [1]:

  Because of AI's surprising history, it's hard to predict when human-level AI might come within reach. When it does, it'll be important to have a leading research institution which can prioritize a good outcome for all over its own self-interest.
  
  We're hoping to grow OpenAI into such an institution. As a non-profit, our aim is to build value for everyone rather than shareholders. Researchers will be strongly encouraged to publish their work, whether as papers, blog posts, or code, and our patents (if any) will be shared with the world. We'll freely collaborate with others across many institutions and expect to work with companies to research and deploy new technologies.  
To me at least, having a walled garden and charging for you API, without releasing weights or other critical details, goes against this sentiment.

[1] https://openai.com/blog/introducing-openai/

Re:GPT-4 by intev on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:31PM (#35155151)
Are we reading the same thing?

It pretty much sounds like they are doing what they said they are going to do? Expecting some sort of free API feels like entitlement to me. Have you tried running the models? Or training them? They get expensive very very fast. They charge a pretty reasonable amount all things considered. If they didn't have the name "Open" in them and or started as a subsidiary of one of the other 3 tech companies things would have gone a very very different route.

Re:GPT-4 by 4gotunameagain on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:32PM (#35155180)
They charge that amount (on loss) to create a trench that will not allow a truly open model to proliferate, as happened with Dall-E and stable diffusion.

And no, I would not train or run the models, even if they released them. This does not mean I cannot point out the hypocrisy.

Re:GPT-4 by intev on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:36PM (#35155248)
> They charge that amount (on loss)

Is this a fact or are you speculating? Because the rest of your sentence falls apart if this is not true.

Re:GPT-4 by 4gotunameagain on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @02:49PM (#35156579)
You yourself said that they get expensive very very fast. Of course I do not have an insider's view on OpenAI's economics. But let's be realistic here.
Re:GPT-4 by intev on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @02:58PM (#35156729)
> But let's be realistic here.

Let's. If I were to rent an instance for short bursts of time, I would be paying many multiples over a constant use instance. If I were to guarantee usage for x years, where the larger the X, the greater the discount. So already the delta between sporadic usage, X years use is large. There is evidence for this price discrepancy within all the cloud providers so this is not speculation. The the price difference is massive.

If you want to save even more cost, you could rent out VPSes or baremetal. They are insanely cheap, and compared to an AWS on demand instance the difference is night and day. Try comparing Hetzner with AWS. Hetzner, as far as I can tell, is not trying to entrench me into their system by offering extremely low prices. Nor are they a charity. I might even say they are an "open" hosting provider. To me it feels like they are passing along most of their savings and taking a small cut.

This is what it feels like to me what openAI is doing. I don't think their prices are so low its unprofitable. But because of their immense scale, its so much cheaper than me running an instance. I don't have to jump into conspiracy land to come up with a reasoning.

Re:GPT-4 by 4gotunameagain on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @03:03PM (#35156808)
Without numbers it is all speculation.
Re:GPT-4 by intev on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @03:08PM (#35156862)
Agreed which is why I made my initial point.

You seemed to want to speculate about how this is all some conniving trap based on their price and I simply pointed out why that's bad speculation using an example in a different industry. I rest my case.

Re:GPT-4 by techfoodie123 on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @08:41PM (#35162002)
i think this is why OpenAI stopped being open -- they were losing money every day. recently they have been finding ways to monetize. have they become profitable already? who knows https://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-defends-role-in-op...
Re:GPT-4 by GaggiX on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:40PM (#35155319)
In the 98-page document on GPT-4, I could not find anything about the actual architecture and details of the model, not only are they now not releasing the models but now also their actual overview.
Re:GPT-4 by cobbal on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:21PM (#35154977)
If they were the first organization known as "OpenXY", then maybe they would have a point, but there's a long tradition of open source libraries/standards using this convention that makes this especially aggravating.

Examples I can think of off the top of my head: OpenGL (1992), OpenAL (2003?), OpenCL (2009), OpenCV (2000).

While looking up those dates though, it seems like OpenAL is now under a proprietary license, which annoys me for the same reason OpenAI annoys me.

Re:GPT-4 by permo-w on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:09PM (#35154746)
the issue is that they started out open source. GPT2 is entirely open-source
Re:GPT-4 by jstummbillig on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:13PM (#35154807)
Only within the context of programmer cults would people be unironically offended that a term as abstract as "open" not be exclusively used to mean "open source".
Re:GPT-4 by shamino on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:04PM (#35154673)
agreed - can you think of any other model that has such unrestricted release ? Open means available for wide use
Re:GPT-4 by arthurcolle on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:07PM (#35154718)
Stable Diffusion v1.4, v2.1

LLaMA

Re:GPT-4 by shamino on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:13PM (#35154812)
LLaMa technically is only limited to researchers, etc...
Re:GPT-4 by arthurcolle on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:31PM (#35155153)
Tell that to the magnet link I clicked on
Re:GPT-4 by whatshisface on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:16PM (#35154885)
The actually open models like BLOOM?
Re:GPT-4 by sylware on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @01:08PM (#35154738)
Where is the noscript/basic (x)html interop support?
Re:GPT-4 by Der_Einzige on Tuesday March 14, 2023 @02:24PM (#35156178)
Go take a look at the content of Civitai. Take everything you see there, and imagine what happens if you start prompting it with words that indicate things which may not be legal for you to see images of.

Please show me viable harm of GPT-4 that is higher than the potential harm from open sourced image generators with really good fine tuning. I'll wait, most likely forever.