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Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by nottathrowaway3 on Thursday March 09, 2023 @05:37PM (#35087825)
Some people don't like nuclear power plants and somehow that's more important to them than national/energy security.

UK (and France) already have the bomb; going renewable here rather than nuclear has nothing to do with proliferation. I don't see how (for the UK) it's anything except people's feelings are hurt by nuclear power plants.

For the rest of Europe maybe it's about proliferation. And maybe economies of scale make tagging along cheaper than local nuclear for Britain.

Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by Gwypaas on Thursday March 09, 2023 @05:44PM (#35087894)
Pure cost. Paying Hinkley Point C $150/MWh for 35 years is just bonkers waste of money. Flamanville 3 is a similarly amazing project.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flamanville_Nuclear_Power_Plan...

Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by nottathrowaway3 on Thursday March 09, 2023 @05:47PM (#35087921)
Average electricity prices (edit/correction: in dense urban areas) in the U.S. are ~$250/mwh

https://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.ph...

Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by epistasis on Thursday March 09, 2023 @05:54PM (#35087991)
Your chart shows residential prices for the total us average ~$140/MWh, not $250/MWh.

Plus, this is the total cost including transmission and distribution, which is roughly half the retail cost. Generation costs average less than $70/MWh, including expensive peaking power in the average.

You want to compare the £150/MWh to generation costs of the alternatives in the UK, which are a fraction of £150.

Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by nottathrowaway3 on Thursday March 09, 2023 @06:52PM (#35088573)
> generation costs of the alternatives in the UK

I'm all for renewable or nuclear energy, whatever's cheaper/strategic. As long as it's not burning fossil fuels.

Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by epistasis on Friday March 10, 2023 @01:07PM (#35098383)
On- and off-shore wind plus storage is going to be a lot cheaper than nuclear, as well this massive transmission line. Hell, at £150/MWh, I bet that solar+storage is cheaper in the dreary parts of the UK.

Maybe Rolls Royce will figure out cheap SMR nuclear, but that won't deploy until late 2030s, I would guess, if it does work.

We are fortunate to have good carbon free alternatives to nuclear, after decades of hard work by renewable technologists. It's real tech.

Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by nottathrowaway3 on Friday March 10, 2023 @05:01PM (#35101786)
> 2030s

> Going to be XYZ

Yeah sure, but every second we spend thinking and talking about it is another second of burning coal and oil.

https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Energy_mix_of_UK.s...

Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by Gwypaas on Thursday March 09, 2023 @05:49PM (#35087948)
Which includes the transmission grid. Nuclear costs that, and then you have to build a grid.
Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by londons_explore on Thursday March 09, 2023 @05:49PM (#35087945)
Yet the spot price of power has been over £150/MWh for most of the last year...

That deal is starting to look pretty good for the government...

Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by p1necone on Thursday March 09, 2023 @06:04PM (#35088107)
Generation cost !== retail all the way to the consumer cost. The latter is always going to be higher, just like all other goods and services.
Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by Gwypaas on Thursday March 09, 2023 @05:51PM (#35087962)
A haphazard continent-wide transition from Russian gas, and all we get is nuclear prices for power? So to get it straight, you are proposing that we always should have an energy crisis in Europe?
Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by londons_explore on Thursday March 09, 2023 @05:53PM (#35087984)
The futures market, even 5 years out, doesn't show a return to old prices.

It looks like the market doesn't expect russian gas to ever return.

Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by Gwypaas on Thursday March 09, 2023 @05:57PM (#35088026)
Like an addon of $10-20/MWh. That does not pay for a nuclear plant.
Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by pyrale on Thursday March 09, 2023 @08:17PM (#35089261)
I believed the strike was under £100 and cost overruns were to be paid by EDF?

Was there a contract change?

Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by Gwypaas on Friday March 10, 2023 @02:12AM (#35091394)
£92.50/MWh in 2012 prices is £122/MWh today. Convert to USD.
Re:$22B project to provide 8% of UK energy via undersea cabl... by crote on Thursday March 09, 2023 @06:07PM (#35088134)
The UK is currently developing 12GW of nuclear power plants, and it is not exactly going great.

Hinkley Point C was originally quoted for £16 billion in 2012, which rose to £20.3 billion when construction started in 2017. It has been under construction for 6 years, they are 3 years behind schedule, and the cost is up to £32.7 billion.

Sizewell C is allowed to start construction and was scheduled to do so in 2021, but they haven't been able to finance it. Moorside was cancelled because Toshiba pulled out of the project, and Hitachi pulled out of the Wylfa B and Moorside plants leading to them getting shelved.

Not to mention that they are very controversial from an economic perspective. Hinkley Point C has a strike price of £92.5/MWh, while recent offshore wind projects have a strike price of £39.65/MWh.

In practice this means the consumer will end up paying to turn off wind turbine in order to run nuclear. It just doesn't make economic sense.