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Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by SteveNuts on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @02:12PM (#35059765)
Sure, try running a thousand VMs on it though (which is an extremely random workload). A single sequential test at an optimal byte size benchmark for a consumer SSD is not representative of a real workload these arrays would see.

Doing so is a lot more complex and intensive than what a single consumer grade SSD can handle.

My point was just that if you wanted to get dedicated IOPs on AWS to match what you get with modern SANs, it’ll cost you far more.

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by riku_iki on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @04:15PM (#35061337)
it is random 4k iops: https://eu.community.samsung.com/t5/image/serverpage/image-i...

I tend to think your number for PS is likely off.

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by SteveNuts on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @04:52PM (#35061784)
In what way? It can do more or less?
Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by riku_iki on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @07:49PM (#35063699)
likely much more: scale with ssd speed and number of disks.

Also, I am not sure how it will stack up against some cloud instance with bunch of ssd under software raid.

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by SteveNuts on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @09:06PM (#35064282)
I agree that if you ran a synthetic benchmark against a brand new pure x20 with 10 NVME drives you'd see astronomical numbers for iops.

That is absolutely not representative of a real workload of mixed reads and writes, different block sizes, potentially different queue depths, all coming in on hundreds or maybe thousands of different volumes.

A single consumer Samsung SSD would hilariously crumble under a real workload, it will NOT deliver hundreds of thousands of IOPs in that environment.

Your benchmark screenshot is the equivalent of showing your pickup truck can do burnouts in the parking lot, and extrapolating that to think it could keep up with a Ferrari on the Nurburgring.

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by riku_iki on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @11:22PM (#35065217)
> That is absolutely not representative of a real workload of mixed reads and writes, different block sizes, potentially different queue depths, all coming in on hundreds or maybe thousands of different volumes.

if you see bottleneck there, it could be that actual SSD speed is maybe irrelevant in your case since upstream software is not optimized.

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by SteveNuts on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @11:59PM (#35065449)
You should definitely start a storage company :-)
Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by riku_iki on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @12:31AM (#35065604)
I am actually trying to get into dataprocessing.
Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by justsomehnguy on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @08:50PM (#35064143)
100% Read or 100% Write are as far from the real workload as it can get. The only exception would be backups read/restore.

Also 1GB test file is often fits in the SSD's RAM cache. Get iometer, 50R/50W%, blocks from 512 to 16k, at least half the size of the storage. Then you would see the real performance.

NB if you have random read way below the random write means you are measuring anything but the storage performance.

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by riku_iki on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @11:36PM (#35065301)
I tried CrystalMark for my desktop SSD with 64GB 4k 50R/50W and got 134K, mostly I think because it has 400K read and 130K write, so writes are bottleneck.

Sorry, lazy to learn how to use iometer, but you probably have SSD too and can report your results.

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by justsomehnguy on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @03:35AM (#35066666)
NO U?

Okay, not a problem: https://imgur.com/a/teoPGrz

Real world performance[+Mix], Read&Write[+Mix]

One is Fujitsu DX200 S4 SSD SAN, other is HFM256GDJTNG-8310A.

Can you guess which is where?

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by riku_iki on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @11:09AM (#35070745)
you have q1t1 only.
Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by justsomehnguy on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @12:42PM (#35072155)
you have no screenshot.
Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by riku_iki on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @01:39PM (#35072984)
I don't intend to prove anything to you ), but I confident you can set q16t16 and will get much better results.
Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by justsomehnguy on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @05:31PM (#35075684)
> I don't intend to prove anything to you

>> but you probably have SSD too and can report your results.

Uh-uh!

I intended to show you the difference between a single NVMe drive and a SSD SAN (a bit old, but still very performant to handle ~900 VMs).

Sure, I can just ramp up queue depth and see some magical numbers, but for me the real performance is in everyday tasks and running CrystalMark isn't an everyday occurrence.

Did you guess which one is SAN?

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by riku_iki on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @06:40PM (#35076311)
> (a bit old, but still very performant to handle ~900 VMs)

I am bit confused how random 4k access is relevant to your task, it should be more like 1MB seq access likely.

My everyday task is tuning heavy data processing pipeline, and I am trying hard to achieve those q16t16.

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by justsomehnguy on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @07:20PM (#35076661)
> how random 4k access is relevant to your task

Sorry? 900 VMs equals 100% full random access. There is no sequential access there, just as I said in my first comment.

> It is obvious there is a difference

Because of your comment[0].

This comment[1] pretty much summarized what I said in a more eloquent way.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35061337

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35064282

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by riku_iki on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @09:22PM (#35077641)
> Sorry? 900 VMs equals 100% full random access. There is no sequential access there, just as I said in my first comment.

it depends on workload, if they do most of the work in RAM, and most of fs traffic is snapshoting and restoring from snapshots, then you will get 99% io seq traffic. If they do some non-trivial fs operations, then you will get q16t16 io traffic. It is very unlikely you will get q1t1 random.

> Because of your comment[0]. > This comment[1] pretty much summarized what I said in a more eloquent way.

In my view you are jumping from topic (single ssd vs nas) to another topic (your speculations about benchmark not representing real world scenarios) and then back.

Re:Pure Storage Teases 300 TB Ultra-Large NVMe SSD with Tent... by jlokier on Wednesday March 08, 2023 @09:42AM (#35069494)
I get 2 to 2.5 million IOPS for 4k random-reads on my personal server.

Running Linux LVM software RAID over 3 x Samsung NVMe SSDs. That's not a read-write measurement, but it's a satisfying number for a not particularly high end server.

(I use it for a side project's database engine experiments. That level of IOPS supports a very high random query rate.)