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Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by chasd00 on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:34AM (#34804303)
The FED wants unemployment to go up which will drive demand, and therefore prices, down. That will reduce inflation.
Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by philipov on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:41AM (#34804402)
Won't unemployment lead to deflation, which is also bad?
Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by chasd00 on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:40AM (#34804388)
replying to sibling comment

"soft landing" is a hope but if bringing the labor market under control ( higher unemployment ) requires a hard landing or recession the FED is prepared and willing to do that. The whole concept of a soft landing is "well that would be nice but it's not the priority".

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by JumpCrisscross on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:37AM (#34804340)
> FED wants unemployment to go up

This is wrong. The Fed doesn’t want higher unemployment. It isn’t even willing to tolerate it. That’s the whole “soft landing” conversation, and why cuts are so cautious.

The ideal path would be labor market loosening with no more unemployment. Absent structural adjustments, that’s possible. But we need structural adjustments, so layoffs are necessary, which makes the closest to ideal layoffs and immediate reuptake, i.e. constant employment with less wage growth.

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by __jem on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:41AM (#34804401)
You're technically correct, but this seems like a bit of a distinction without a difference. The Fed may not want unemployment, but they do want people to lose their jobs, and an obvious risk of people losing their jobs is that they'll be unemployed. There's no guarantee the Fed will stick the "soft landing."
Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by JumpCrisscross on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:45AM (#34804462)
> they do want people to lose their jobs, and an obvious risk of people losing their jobs is that they'll be unemployed

No, they want less nominal wage growth. The less people lose their jobs, the better. But economies don’t adjust without creaking, which means yes, an expected effect is layoffs and bankruptcies. But the Fed doesn’t want that, and goes to significant lengths, often with negative impact on its price-level mandate, to manage this downside.

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by chasd00 on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:44AM (#34804452)
"soft landing" is a hope but if bringing the labor market under control ( higher unemployment ) requires a hard landing or recession the FED is prepared and willing to do that. The whole concept of a soft landing is "well that would be nice but it's not the priority".
Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by Octoth0rpe on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:45AM (#34804460)
Maybe the reason why people keep repeating it is because that's more or less what Powell keeps saying: "Reducing inflation will likely require a sustained period of below-trend growth, and it will very likely require a softening of labor conditions," (source: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/federal-reserve-interest-rate-h...)

Softening of labor conditions is pretty directly saying "Increase unemployment".

> and why cuts are so cautious.

They're so cautious because they want to hit the right amount of increased unemployment, not that they don't want unemployment to go up at all.

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by JumpCrisscross on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:47AM (#34804487)
> Softening of labor conditions is pretty directly saying "Increase unemployment"

Not at all. It means less nominal wage growth. That can and does happen without an increase in even job losses, let alone unemployment. (You can have job losses with constant or even increasing employment.)

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by Octoth0rpe on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:52AM (#34804575)
That seems extremely hypothetical. Sure, in specific anecdotal places/times wages got frozen and employment stayed fixed, but I don't think _anyone_ expects that to happen at a national level if the policy goal of the day is to "soften labor conditions". The expectation is higher unemployment. I think most people understand this.
Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by JumpCrisscross on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:56AM (#34804643)
> seems extremely hypothetical

It’s literally what we’re seeing right now. It’s not the norm, but it’s precedented[1], most recently in America in the 90s.

[1] http://pombo.free.fr/phillips1958.pdf

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by aCoreyJ on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @11:01AM (#34805616)
There is a major difference between "this thing we have to do in order to hit our target 2% inflation rate may unfortunately increase unemployment" and "the fed wants layoffs"

Also job numbers have been incredibly good so it's not even generally true unemployment is increasing outside of sectors that are incredibly susceptible to fears of recession.

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by Octoth0rpe on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @11:29AM (#34806116)
> There is a major difference between "this thing we have to do in order to hit our target 2% inflation rate may unfortunately increase unemployment" and "the fed wants layoffs"

I don't think that is a major difference to someone who is laid off because of intentional decisions that the fed makes to effect an outcome, knowing that layoffs will be a consequence.

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by JumpCrisscross on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @12:05PM (#34806943)
> don't think that is a major difference to someone who is laid off because of intentional decisions that the fed makes to effect an outcome

The difference between being laid off and having job offers versus going onto a growing roll of the unemployed is major. We're not seeing a meaningful increase in unemployment [1][2].

[1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/ICSA

[2] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CCSA

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by btbuildem on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:48AM (#34804504)
Prices never come down. Except maybe gasoline, after it jumps high in a panic now and again. Everything else just ratchets up, always.

The best I can understand it, the low interest rates encourage lending / borrowing, which expands the money supply. As the supply of real goods and services is not keeping up, theres more money than goods, so prices of everything go up.

Layoffs are a way of keeping wages down, but that's just corporate greed. If wages went up, it would effectively negate inflation - we'd just get extra zeros on everything, but individual purchasing power would stay on par (you could still pay your rent with half a paycheck, etc).

Of course in a global economy that would cause the country to be at a disadvantage in the import/export game.

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by sokoloff on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:56AM (#34804648)
Some categories do deflate over time. Consumer electronics, cell phone services, toys are examples that are cheaper now than 10, 20, or 30 years ago.

You can get a 43" 1080p TV for $150: https://www.bestbuy.com/site/insignia-43-class-n10-series-le...

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by dcow on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @10:32AM (#34805111)
I never quite understood this. For things that are new and novel it makes sense for proce to decrease over time, like TV tech (do note that OLEDs today aren't any cheaper so the category is not TVs it’s LCD TVs). But games/toys it does not. It implies quality is lower or efficiency of production is higher and with something like video games I really doubt efficiency is higher. This is why I welcome the $10 price hike for video games. I want good games again.
Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by sokoloff on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @11:44AM (#34806486)
I paid $3500 for a high quality 480p TV in 1997. A 4K OLED TV that will stomp all over that TV can be had now for under $1500. In nominal dollars, the TV fell by over 50%. In real dollars, it fell by over 75%.
Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by dcow on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @11:55AM (#34806755)
I spent $3500 on a nice OLED a few years ago. You’re not wrong, but there’s a lot of variance in what you compare.
Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by ROTMetro on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @12:23PM (#34807281)
Now do car prices.
Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by sokoloff on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @01:14PM (#34808117)
Cars have both increased in reliability and features and deflated significantly in real terms. They have not deflated in nominal terms as consumer electronics have.

https://www.in2013dollars.com/New-cars/price-inflation

Re:DigitalOcean Is Doing Layoffs Right Now by HDThoreaun on Wednesday February 15, 2023 @09:59AM (#34804681)
Commodity prices fluctuate wildly. That means food.