What do you mean by using EVs to balance the grid? How is drawing more power from it balancing it?

Many utilities are interested in using EVs as batteries for the grid. After all, typical EVs sold today have 60-100kWh batteries and are sitting parked the majority of the time. The idea is the utility would offer payment or incentive to use your battery and balance the grid.

The idea has been for a while, and is starting to come to wider testing with the finalization of Vehicle to Grid standards for the CCS charging standard.

Some other charging standards like Chademo already upported this but aren't widely used in Europe or North America.

Of course, that most logical thing which owners of an expensive BEV will do, is joining a program where they can cycle out their expensive battery and come to discharged car at the morning.

I think it would depend on the implementation of the program, but if the incentive is right, people will join. Many utilities already offer voluntary curtailment programs and time-of-use incentives, and customers definitely respond.

Modern batteries with modern battery management systems are more durable than you think. Most things I've read expect a typical EV battery to retain usable capacity past the lifespan of the car itself, not to mention EVs typically have "hidden" capacity buffers against degradation.

I doubt any program would completely discharge a car, likely a program would involve a smart charger that would charge and discharge within a certain agreed upon window.

Look at the current residential demand response programs for an example. Details vary, but a quick search will show you a range of different programs.

Typically, utilities will announce incentive windows for peak periods ahead of time. Opt-in customers have thermostats that will respond to the peak program by reducing heat or cooling to an agreed upon temperature. The customer can override if they would like, but if they do they will lose the incentive.

Customers get a lower bill, utilities can save a lot shaving peak loads and avoid capacity problems.

As an BEV owner, there is no way in hell I would let incompetent utility company purposefully damage my battery, because they were too greedy to build their own storage.

Fair enough, these types of programs are opt-in for a reason. I definitely would consider it if the price is right.

For me, a personal vehicle is a depreciating asset that sits unused 98% of the time. I'd be better off with carshare if it existed in my city.

If the program also allowed me to use the battery as a home backup, I'd opt-in.

I was skeptical as well, but enough people have signed up that it works. Our personal opinion doesnt matter.

People who don't understand that they are exchanging their battery life for few cents. Eventually word will spread out and those programs are going to become mandatory.

The original statement was - BEVs will overload the grid, this discussion shows oposite is the case - they are used to stabilise the grid.

> those programs are going to become mandatory

I would say the jury is still out if it makes financial sence. Batteries lose capacity to aging even if you don't use them.

This is extremely speculative and if the government has appetite to make anything mandatory about cars, they would start by enforcing the speed limit electronically

> The original statement was - BEVs will overload the grid, this discussion shows oposite is the case - they are used to stabilise the grid.

Not at all.

The EVs' batteries are used as storage, which can help with intermittent electricity production but it implies two things assuming it can work at all:

1. enough electricity is produced overall,

2. the grid has the capacity to move all that electricity around.

These are the two issues I initially mentioned and using EVs' batteries as temporary storage solves neither.

It's a lot more than a few cents. This guy made $550 for delivering 297 kWh of electricity over a one year period.

https://electrek.co/2023/02/09/tesla-powerwall-owners-made-5...

So do it for 32 more years to have money for a new battery. As I said, few cents.

The way I interpret that link to Octopus' website is simply that they over an off peak tariff to charge your EV at the best times for them, probably whenever there is excess electricity available. It does not say anything about using the EVs as storage. The "virtual powerplant" seems to be just a PR gimmick, which Octopus is very good at.

In amy case, that does not solve the issue of overall production or grid capacity.

> In amy case, that does not solve the issue of overall production or grid capacity.

Actually that could have done well (although I wouldn’t hold my breath + all sorts of logistics of reality can prevent the utility). If you have 100 MWh of car batteries charging during off peak, that’s extra capacity you can leverage during peak hours.

I do agree that in practice that won’t work out for all sorts of reasons (the comms and standards for that aren’t defined afaik + what happens if enough cars disconnect that suddenly you don’t have enough capacity and brownouts begin to shed load)