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Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by smoldesu on Sunday February 05, 2023 @10:43AM (#34665763)
And people fall for it. It's crazy how many people blindly buy into TE's "homestyle" marketing like they're some hibrow synth company. The OP-1 tickles every American's "Product Cortex" in their brain though, immediately associating brutalist design and Corinthian leather with quality engineering. It doesn't matter if we're not the target audience, we just want to spend money on pretty things that make us feel good. The OP-1 is like the rich man's fidget spinner, I see it on someone's desk and assume that they have too much time and money on their hands.

Just goes to show that you can take pretty much anything, market it to relatively affluent and bored tech workers and make a killing.

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by kzrdude on Sunday February 05, 2023 @11:20AM (#34666082)
The OP-1 is an instrument though, it seems like a pretty amazing instrument for creativity for those that can use it. And most instruments are more expensive than it..
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by smoldesu on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:13PM (#34667204)
I've tried a lot of grooveboxes in my time, and the OP-1 is one of the only instruments I've ever seen that has worse value-per-dollar than the DSI Tempest. Very few instruments are expensive and useless enough to justify this; the OP-1 is solidly among them though.

All I'll say is that you should reserve your judgement until you've tried some competing products. The Playmobil laptop looks like a great way to do your Word documents until you try a Dell or Apple machine.

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by kzrdude on Sunday February 05, 2023 @02:16PM (#34667964)
Which one would you recommend? For an easy to use low end starting point.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by smoldesu on Sunday February 05, 2023 @02:44PM (#34668362)
I'd probably recommend the Model: Samples if you're interested in sampling, or the Novation Circuit if you want to focus on synthesis. The Model: Samples in particular is great - it's an adaptation of Elektron's more expensive Digitakt that puts the core featureset in a more focused box. It would probably be my sub-$400 desert-island groovebox choice.

Edit: it's worth noting that both of these systems are sequencers, not tape recorders. I consider that a benefit (much longer record times) but if you want a multitrack recorder then you should look elsewhere (maybe a 4iXo DAC?)

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by ilyt on Sunday February 05, 2023 @02:15PM (#34667956)
OP-1 owner eh ?

Sure it's cheap if you compare it to Stradivarius, but if you use instruments in same type ("a CPU feeding ADC/DAC with some knobs and buttons") it is one of most expensive one in category.

OP-1 field (the only version they sell) is 2000 EUR. That's top end of synth world and you usually get more knobs and keys with that. That's the price of Korg/Roland/Yamaha workstation-level keyboards.

Do NOT try to compare it on price with anything, it will always look like a bad joke. Subjective, might be worth to you etc.

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by psychomugs on Sunday February 05, 2023 @12:33PM (#34666758)
So... you judge character based on appearances?

No other gear company has tackled the all-in-one synth-sequencer-4trackrecorder-groovebox that is the OP-1 in the decade since its release. TE not capitalizing on this would be financially naive.

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by whatshisface on Sunday February 05, 2023 @12:59PM (#34667057)
I am pretty sure real professionals use carefully configured personal computers with keyboards plugged in.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by psychomugs on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:29PM (#34667373)
The same as how professional photographers use expensive 'real' capital-C Cameras with interchangeable capital-L Lenses but still carry pocketable point-and-shoots for 'fun,' e.g. Ricoh GR, Fuji X100. Tools should be enjoyable to use, which these gadgets offer in spades.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by whatshisface on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:46PM (#34667576)
But in this case, the just-for-fun pocket device is more often expensive than the capital-K Keyboard.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by psychomugs on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:53PM (#34667667)
Both of the cameras I listed are more expensive than many perfectly capable interchangeable-lens cameras (Ricoh GR ~$1000, Fuji X100 ~$1300 [currently prone to scalping for even more]), but still rightfully warrant the demand because of their usability.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by smoldesu on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:58PM (#34667749)
Which is fine. If professionals collect them for novelty, nothing is lost. If a beginner were to spend all their money on a novelty camera instead of an interchangeable lens model, then it does become a bit of a waste. Almost like they bought into the hype because of the end-product or social sex-appeal, a phenomenon that ties neatly into TE's marketing.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by psychomugs on Sunday February 05, 2023 @02:12PM (#34667919)
They aren't novelties any more than using a prime non-zoom lens on an antique film camera is a novelty. That would be tantamount to claiming that playing on a large unwieldy needs-to-be-tuned acoustic piano is a novelty compared to a digital keybed with plugins.

"The enemy of art is the absence of limitations."

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by ilyt on Sunday February 05, 2023 @02:09PM (#34667878)
Smaller devices are still used as notepad for ideas.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by smoldesu on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:10PM (#34667184)
My opinion is based off the weekend I spent with a rented model. I very quickly realized that the OP-1 is like an iPhone app that someone turned into pricy hardware.

> No other gear company has tackled the all-in-one synth-sequencer-4trackrecorder-groovebox

Seriously?

Plenty of other companies have. If you're old enough to remember, Elektron had an 8 track sequencer/recorder/groovebox that cost roughly the same price as the OP-1. Their mono model was actually cheaper than the OP-1 (and arguably nicer).

...which is of course to ignore the hundreds of other sub-$1000 grooveboxes that do 90% of what the OP-1 does. Hell, that's to ignore DAWs that cost 1/3rd of the price with 300% more features. If you buy an OP-1 as your introduction to electronic music, you are wasting your money.

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by psychomugs on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:26PM (#34667335)
That last 10% is precisely the point. Nothing AFAIK has the audio-oriented tape-style workflow with a keyboard and groovebox functionality in as small a footprint as the OP-1. The reality is that the OP-1 has been successful enough to warrant a successor and that are not negatively affecting other manufacturers doing whatever they want to do with their offerings, and this affects you personally... how?
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by smoldesu on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:29PM (#34667375)
I just find it utterly fascinating how rich, clueless tech workers throw money at cool-looking companies they see on YouTube. It's so unfathomably stupid to me that I feel the need to share it on HN, but I realize in retrospect this community might not share my opinion.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by psychomugs on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:36PM (#34667455)
It's unfathomably stupid to me that one would care so much about what others spend their money on, as if it were something actively harmful.

To each their own, the only real winner here is the one selling their product.

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by smoldesu on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:39PM (#34667490)
Sometimes I forget this is a business website first, tech website second. Touché, the abject waste of money is so easy to ignore when you contextualize it on a website of moonshot founders and Apple enthusiasts.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by psychomugs on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:48PM (#34667603)
I have a fair share of dislikes of what people spend their money on, e.g. conspicuous consumption on fads, Teslas in particular, because they have or will directly impact my being as an individual through policy and regulation. The instrument someone enjoys making music on is so insignificant that it shouldn't warrant my concern.

Then again, considering how little progress there is to be made with music technology and how much of the industry is buoyed by marketing and brand, it makes sense that people defend their choice of consumption so fervently.

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by smoldesu on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:53PM (#34667669)
If you don't care about it, nobody is egging you into further conversation. I talk about this stuff because I enjoy making music, and there is intellectually gratifying criticism to be made on the gear being produced today. If you don't care about that, then admittedly I could see how this is pedantic and pointless.

Like I said above, it's my mistake for criticizing consumerism on a website that lives, eats and dies on how much people buy into arbitrary things like marketing and brand.

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by ilyt on Sunday February 05, 2023 @02:04PM (#34667828)
It's not "care", it's morbid curiosity about how psyche of humans work.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by psychomugs on Sunday February 05, 2023 @07:53PM (#34671789)
There is a marked difference between curiosity and kvetching.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by ilyt on Monday February 06, 2023 @03:01AM (#34674574)
"Who in right mind buys this overpriced gadget? Why ?" is both.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by ta8903 on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:32PM (#34667408)
Yep, if you really think about it people not overcharging for their products are the real suckers.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by status200 on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:36PM (#34667463)
Synthstrom Deluge does everything the OP-1 does (and much more), and was $400 cheaper until recently.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by psychomugs on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:43PM (#34667542)
No UI, no keyboard requiring a different mental interface if you are coming from a traditional i.e. piano-based instrument, at least twice the size.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by heeen2 on Sunday February 05, 2023 @01:43PM (#34667549)
It's also much bigger and heavier though.
Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by ilyt on Sunday February 05, 2023 @02:03PM (#34667808)
Shh don't tell Uli Behringer about it /s

I think it is because "just making same thing" is frowned upon and also industry cares to not eat itself.

For example take Digitakt and Digitone. It could easily be combined into one device "it is just code" and CPUs got faster since release of those but they don't, because they know having those "blind spots" in each of their devices (that other of their devices fit) is good for sales. Got a Digitone ? Want Drum machine to it ? Well, Digitakt got same interface you already know. Even their newest device Syntakt omits a lot of FM stuff to not step on Digitone niche.

Also there is plenty all-in-ones with more capability, all the way to monsters like MASCHINE+, MPC X or Force. People buy OP-1 coz they want to work within the limits and think that will make better music, not because it can do something unique anything else can't.

Which is understandable, given myriad options it's easy to get lost in tinkering with them instead of focusing on creation.

Re:The founder of Teenage Engineering opens up to his creati... by sramsay on Sunday February 05, 2023 @12:59PM (#34667065)
They’re the Sharper Image of audio.