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Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by ryukoposting on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @06:28PM (#34512147)
Signal was a brilliant app. It can send messages with rich media, host group chats, and even do voice and video calls, all with the peace of mind that comes from a proper secure messaging app. The best part was that you could still send messages to people who don't use Signal. Signal was the messaging app everyone wants - all the benefits of iMessage, without being siloed in one particular ecosystem.

Sometime leading up to October of 2022, the folks at the Signal foundation lost the plot. Signal has since dropped support for SMS, and is inexplicably adding "stories" to their personal messaging app. I despise this.

Instead of just complaining about it, I decided to do something about it. Here is a link to a version of the Signal Android app that still supports SMS, and doesn't have stories. There also isn't a stupid, nagging banner telling you to update. Right now, it's just Signal 5.38 with a couple lines commented out, but I plan to integrate any upstream security/UX improvements in the near future. For now, you'll have to build/install it yourself, but I will eventually put an APK out there for people to download. Enjoy!

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by sinistersnare on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @06:44PM (#34512278)
I appreciate your effort! I was loathe to leave Signal, but I can't support them after all of the dumb stuff they've been doing. They also added some sort of crypto a couple years ago?

The default android messenger is good enough I guess.

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by barbazoo on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @06:44PM (#34512280)
> I will eventually put an APK out there for people to download

That defeats the purpose of Signal I would say

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by Defletter on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:31PM (#34512679)
How so?
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by barbazoo on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @09:31PM (#34513655)
Running your secure and private messenger from a build made by a person on the internet you don't know you can trust.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by petodo on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @04:11AM (#34516152)
here you can download APK since he doesn't provide one

https://github.com/johanw666/Signal-Android

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by NayamAmarshe on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @06:47PM (#34512306)
I think it's against their policies to create third party clients unlike Telegram?

IIRC, Moxie disliked the idea of modified clients.

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by 4bpp on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:18PM (#34512565)
Well, part of the point of the GPL (under which the official client is licensed) is that you can't really prevent people from doing that. Of course the party operating the servers has the discretion to ban users of modified clients on sight, but recognising those users may be difficult. The GPL forces them to provide sources with any new release of the official client, and barring some sort of endpoint integrity attestation in the spirit of DRM systems in games (which a far larger segment of their target group than those who would use unofficial clients would reject) they could not distinguish a patched build whose behaviour on the network is the same as the official client from their own.

I think any "homesteading the noosphere"-style arguments that grant Moxie moral rights to control the use of the software that go beyond his contractual rights are rendered much less compelling by the presence of network effects. To interface with Moxie's captive userbase, you can't avoid trespassing on his homestead.

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by akerl_ on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @08:09PM (#34512991)
The GPL doesn't require them to provide source with any new release of the official client. They're the author, and hold the copyright. They can decide tomorrow that all future versions of Signal will be closed-source, and then just stop providing source.

They can't retroactively un-GPL existing released versions/code.

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by 4bpp on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @08:10PM (#34526514)
For them to relicense it, they would need to hold the copyright to all the code. Do the Signal authors actually have it?
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by gwillen on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:07PM (#34512480)
Moxie has made his decision; now let him enforce it.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by arafatamim on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:01PM (#34512425)
Molly is a hardened Signal fork without the crypto stuff
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by NayamAmarshe on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:07PM (#34512483)
Oh cool, reproducible builds without GCM.

The only flaw is this: > you cannot use the same phone number on both apps at the same time. Only the last app to register will remain active, and the other will go offline

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by ryukoposting on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @09:17AM (#34518477)
Refer to other comments - this isn't really a "third party client," it's an exact copy of their code with two or three lines changed.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by hacker_junky on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:10PM (#34512504)
Wow, that sounds great! What led you to make these changes to the Signal Android app? How can others join you in these efforts?
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by capableweb on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:19PM (#34512572)
Seems like they wrote exactly why?

> Sometime leading up to October of 2022, the folks at the Signal foundation lost the plot. Signal has since dropped support for SMS, and is inexplicably adding "stories" to their personal messaging app. I despise this.

> Instead of just complaining about it, I decided to do something about it.

True hackers :) Thank you

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by ehPReth on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:21PM (#34512585)
why is everyone so anti-stories? I really don't understand
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by hadlock on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:47PM (#34512805)
I don't want social media crap in my messaging app. I use it for work and business notifications. When I want to waste time I have other apps for that sort of thing.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by WithinReason on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @06:38AM (#34517112)
Have you even seen a single Signal story?
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by joshspankit on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @08:45PM (#34513300)
It’s a canary in the coalmine. Stories shows a shift away from a singular focus on security and towards being a copy of everything else. As well, many of us have seen good services die because they started to try to be like everyone else.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by mlindner on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:21PM (#34512587)
> Sometime leading up to October of 2022, the folks at the Signal foundation lost the plot. Signal has since dropped support for SMS, and is inexplicably adding "stories" to their personal messaging app. I despise this.

On iPhone Signal never support SMS in the first place. Just sounds like they're smartly keeping it consistent that all messages are secure rather than intermixing non-secure and secure messaging, which was a dumb idea from the get go.

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by chungy on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:47PM (#34512812)
Couldn't disagree more. Having a singular app handle all messaging was brilliant and a key feature to bring people over.

Apple disallowing competition isn't a good reason to remove something useful for Android users.

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by growse on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @04:50PM (#34524650)
> Couldn't disagree more. Having a singular app handle all messaging was brilliant and a key feature to bring people over.

> Apple disallowing competition isn't a good reason to remove something useful for Android users.

Nice in theory, but RCS breaks everything here.

You send someone at SMS in Signal, they reply but their client "upgrades" it to RCS. Signal never receives the reply (because the RCS android API is private), and now everyone blames Signal for "dropping messages".

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by mlindner on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @04:57PM (#34524719)
But why does putting all your messaging in a single app help bring people over? People have always juggled multiple messaging clients since forever ago.

I personally use 4 different ones at the moment (Signal, Messages(SMS+iMessage), LINE, and Snapchat) and lots of other people I know also use WhatsApp, Messenger, or one of the various Chinese messaging apps. I don't think I know anyone who uses just a single messaging app.

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by monetus on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:49PM (#34512823)
"dumb idea from the get go."

You could potentially send an unencrypted msg if you fat fingered the send button into a long press, a swipe, and then another tap.

Otherwise, people messaging you would just find themselves silently upgraded to encrypted messenging, because it was the default already on both phones. It was a boon for security overall, but allowed a.. Not a pitfall so much as a pit climb that could be a security let down.

The silent upgrade of everyday messages broadened signal from that platform people use to talk about black market stuff to that platform people use to text.

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by omeid2 on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @08:13PM (#34513029)
Silent upgrade and so silent downgrade instead of fail to send? Risky.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by rcthompson on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @08:47PM (#34513320)
It's not silent, the UI clearly indicated when you were sending messages encrypted or unencrypted.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by jamal-kumar on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @12:47AM (#34514868)
I guess politicians and their staffers are just doing black market dealings if your reductionistic point of view holds out to be true [1]

[1] https://www.forbes.com/sites/zakdoffman/2020/02/24/new-whats...

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by monetus on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @04:04AM (#34516105)
Hyperbole is useful for illustrating a point, please take people in good faith.

The point was that the signal users are being fragmented, divided amongst those who do and don't mind inconvenience to hide their messaging. At the time they are pushing the social media features like stories, groups, and payments, it doesn't make sense to tamp down on android's network effect.

Politicians don't have to worry about their staffers uninstalling the app but forgetting to tell the campaign.

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by mlindner on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @04:58PM (#34524735)
That doesn't sound like a silent upgrade but instead a silent downgrade to cleartext, a big security no-no that should never be performed.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by wolverine876 on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:51PM (#34512846)
I agree. It was risky for users, who associate Signal with 'secure'.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by fluidcruft on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @11:16PM (#34514344)
The real problem is that Google and carriers are moving Android to RCS+SMS. SMS is awaiting execution.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by simfree on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @01:04AM (#34514940)
Good luck killing SMS when the RCS APIs are for Google Messages (and rebranded Android OEM messages apps) only. The few paid RCS messaging APIs that exist are priced like caviar compared to SMS.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by fluidcruft on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @08:18AM (#34517891)
Yeah. The reality is that RCS is happening and leaves Signal in the same position they are on iOS where SMS is only supported/allowed via Apple's app and they can't touch.

SMS-only users will be left in the cold. It used to be that if you use SMS you were a pariah on iOS with low quality MMS etc. Pretty soon SMS users will be a pariah on both iOS and Android. Not to mention how things change if/when the EU forces Apple to support RCS.

Furthermore RCS is adding encryption. So Signal users who communicate via SMS are missing out on that possibility to improve their use of encrypted communication with users who don't use Signal.

The narrative of the Signal+SMS silent upgrade is also falling apart. As RCS support continues to roll out, you are actively downgrading a user's experience if you install Signal as their SMS client.

Frankly I don't see these facts support SMS in Signal being worth any developer effort. And if literally anything in the SMS stack results is a security breach of a Signal user, Signal gets all the egg on their face. It just does not make sense for SMS to exist in Signal.

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by petodo on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @04:07AM (#34516122)
Right, just like MMS killed SMS. Good luck trying to kill simple plain text message with shaky Google RCS support, which ain't some international open standard.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by handedness on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:27PM (#34512641)
I couldn't agree more, and I love to see this kind of a response to their change in focus.

Here's another fork doing something similar: https://github.com/johanw666/Signal-Android/releases

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by cowmix on Tuesday January 24, 2023 @07:39PM (#34512738)
If your fork takes off, I (and others) would love to help contribute. Things like ChromeOS/Android table support (which many forks have added in the past) and being able to use an Android phone/tablet as a link device would be great.
Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by petodo on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @04:09AM (#34516139)
there is already Singal fork with no APK expire whrere you can keep using SMS as long as you want

https://github.com/johanw666/Signal-Android

Re:Re-Adding SMS Support to Signal by ryukoposting on Wednesday January 25, 2023 @09:10AM (#34518408)
These are intriguing ideas, but I can't guarantee that will happen. I'm a firmware engineer by trade, but I know enough Android stuff to do basic things.