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Re:Excess Management Is Costing the U.S. $3T Per Year (2016) by namaria on Saturday January 07, 2023 @05:47PM (#34293833)
I find this view interesting if you think the origin of the concept (of bureaucracy) illustrates the transition from arbitrary management towards a rule-based, rational (and very much productivity enhancing) approach...
Re:Excess Management Is Costing the U.S. $3T Per Year (2016) by quickthrower2 on Saturday January 07, 2023 @06:18PM (#34294105)
Great for work that is amenable to strict process. Getting burgers out in 3 minutes for example.
Re:Excess Management Is Costing the U.S. $3T Per Year (2016) by namaria on Saturday January 07, 2023 @06:44PM (#34294331)
Also great when you want national resources managed by policy and not by cronyism. I get the modern trope that bureaucracy = bad, the whole point I'm trying to make is: the concept was first proposed as an idea of improvement in administration in the 1800s.
Re:Excess Management Is Costing the U.S. $3T Per Year (2016) by pixl97 on Saturday January 07, 2023 @07:52PM (#34294821)
One half of people think that bureaucracy is bad because it's in the way of the work they are trying to get done.

The other half think it's bad because they can't steal everything that's not nailed down.

Re:Excess Management Is Costing the U.S. $3T Per Year (2016) by pishpash on Saturday January 07, 2023 @08:39PM (#34295099)
And sometimes stealing everything that's not nailed down is the way work gets done, i.e. disruption. Trying to manage this out based on some anodyne rules out of a committee makes for a perfectly harmonious but completely static, risk-averse organization of little potential.

It's like trying to censor speech. You get rid of "bad" speech but you also get no interesting speech. Is it really worth it?

Re:Excess Management Is Costing the U.S. $3T Per Year (2016) by bawolff on Saturday January 07, 2023 @07:39PM (#34294732)
Most things have a golden middle amount, where its great in the right amount but sucks if you have too much or too little. Bureaucracy is no exception. Trying to make a large group of people work towards a common goal effectively is really hard without some management. Too much though is extremely stifling.
Re:Excess Management Is Costing the U.S. $3T Per Year (2016) by Rury on Saturday January 07, 2023 @09:16PM (#34295300)
The thing is, it's needed. You can't have an organization without some level of bureaucracy. It's what ensures an organization, works and remains to be a functional organization.

But it's very nature is anti productive. By this I mean, documenting, discussing, approving, and creating boundaries, all work to slow down an organization, even though it's necessary to ensure the wellbeing of the organization. As a specific example, organizations often have separation of duties for certain things (like activities involving pay to avoid embezzlement from happening), but doing so naturally slows down the handling of these activities. If one person has to do his part, then write documentation to instruct what they're trying to do and what they need someone else to do, send those instructions to someone else, wait for their approval, and then send it to someone else to process it... all of this is slower, than if the person who wrote the instructions, skipped writing the instructions, and approved and processed it themselves. But obviously that can result in some bad situations, and hence why some bureaucracy is inevitably necessary.