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Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by benreesman on Thursday December 15, 2022 @04:25AM (#33997120)
I have yet to see an output from a big language model that doesn’t just look like P(text|internet).

I understand that it’s very easy to ascribe all kinds of qualities to these things, but when the corpus is the Internet, the log likelihood of it sounding like a person is not so different from the corpus sounding like a person.

These things are impressive enough without any magical thinking.

Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by chriswarbo on Thursday December 15, 2022 @04:37AM (#33997209)
> I have yet to see an output from a big language model that doesn’t just look like P(text|internet)

True, but the same can be said of many things; e.g. biology just looks like P(reproduction|environment), the economy just looks like P(profit|markets), etc.

There can still be rich structure inside, and useful abstractions to describe them.

Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by benreesman on Thursday December 15, 2022 @05:30AM (#33997555)
Yeah and I hope I didn’t come off like I was trying to knock the technical achievement: it’s remarkable along multiple dissensions: at a minimum technical, infrastructural, mathematical (you don’t throw 25-50k A100s for months at something without running some serious numbers first).

It’s possible that I’ve just fallen too far under the influence of Deutsch and Marletto, but as someone who has worked on systems like this I’m rather skeptical that one of these things is going to break the gridlock between quantum theory and general relatively any time soon.

There’s no reason why one couldn’t principle but I’ve babysat enough big ML systems that I tend to think in terms of “how do we keep this thing from shitting itself” rather than “damn this thing is going to win a Fields medal if I turn my back on it”.

Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by sinenomine on Thursday December 15, 2022 @08:11AM (#33998975)
It is common to switch to a conservative mode of thought upon entering one's domain of competence;

The question is, though, if the expertise and intuition developed during, say, running XGboost classifiers at scale in AdTech really of much relevance when thinking about large transformer models trained with a self-supervised objective and RLHF?

If you try to study this in depth, these models can do something the usual "datascience"-tier ones commonly cannot: https://arxiv.org/abs/2205.10343 https://moultano.wordpress.com/2020/10/18/why-deep-learning-...

Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by benreesman on Thursday December 15, 2022 @08:40AM (#33999315)
If you’re curious about how we used ensembled weak learners to form a strong enough learner to kick the shit out of everyone except DoubleClick in AdTech, this is a decent start: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ensemble_learning.

By the standards of AdTech, latent space stuff was pretty unproven when I left the game a few years ago.

Low-rank approximations were in some sense implicit in that, but were not at that time an explicit goal.

If I were doing an AdTech system from scratch I’d most likely reach for the kind of recommender systems that you’re alluding to sooner.

Sounds like you know your stuff :)

Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by sandgiant on Thursday December 15, 2022 @06:18AM (#33997864)
I don't think anyone looks a biological systems and thinks they are well described by P(reproduction|environment). ChatGPT, on the other hand, is P(text|internet) more or less by definition (it's more than that, but not much more).

The fact that we observe what looks like emergent structures such as "understanding", "knowledge" or "reasoning" is fantastic, but it is not in any way incompatible with a P(text|internet) model simply "mimicking" humans.

I agree that exploring the inner workings of these emergent features is interesting in it's own right, but all that glitters is not gold.

Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by ImprobableTruth on Thursday December 15, 2022 @05:39AM (#33997592)
The article links multiple papers on chain of thought reasoning. There are tasks that language models struggle with, but when you ask it to explain its reasoning, certain large language models do much better than the scaling for the normal prompt would suggest. Calling this an 'ascribed' quality is crazy, it's just an observation and says nothing about the internals. Hell, you could even test it yourself if you don't trust the papers.

Sayings that it just looks like P(text|internet) is a tautology, it's a text predictor trained on the internet. This doesn't tell you anything about why phenomena like the above occur, or why it occurs only in large language models and only in some of them.

Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by benreesman on Thursday December 15, 2022 @06:02AM (#33997742)
I hope my comment didn’t imply that I’m anything short of impressed: it’s truly a feat.

But it’s one thing to regurgitate a causal structure that’s been said over and over and quite another to propose a novel and falsifiable hypothesis.

Telling a novel-ish just so story is well within the reach of a precocious 8 year old, and that’s selling the bright year old short.

Let’s see one of things propose a novel hypothesis before we get our drawers moist.

Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by loa_in_ on Thursday December 15, 2022 @05:42AM (#33997614)
Gpt-3 plays the Wikipedia game pretty well. Ask it to follow and list all articles between one article and other by inter-article links. I liked it because most have Wikipedia corpus already learned.
Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by DebtDeflation on Thursday December 15, 2022 @07:08AM (#33998272)
The more I play with it, the more it feels like a Google Knowledge Graph result that's been run through a generative model to rewrite the text in a different style.
Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by kewp on Thursday December 15, 2022 @07:53AM (#33998764)
Isn't it possible that intelligence is P(words|every sequence of words you've ever heard)?
Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by Eliezer on Thursday December 15, 2022 @07:59AM (#33998843)
Then where would sensible words come from, for the first time, in hominid history?
Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by rthomas6 on Thursday December 15, 2022 @09:16AM (#33999801)
P(sounds when object is present|random sounds other people made when object was present) ?
Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by joshuahedlund on Thursday December 15, 2022 @08:27AM (#33999175)
No, you’re conflating System 1 thinking and System 2 thinking.
Re:How Does GPT Obtain Its Ability? Tracing Emergent Abiliti... by oliveshell on Thursday December 15, 2022 @07:58AM (#33998815)
Possible? Maybe. I believe we know enough now, however, to conclude that it’s astonishingly unlikely.