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Re:LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after ... by hiq on Thursday November 17, 2022 @06:25AM (#33637440)
> A blockchain powers Secure Scuttlebutt

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Scuttlebutt doesn't have the word blockchain on it, and from reading the protocol section, I don't think it uses a public blockchain as defined there: https://www.schneier.com/essays/archives/2019/02/theres_no_g...

So you're just talking about something else, but as Schneier argues, anything other than a public blockchain is nothing new and has little to do with all the hype beyond the confusing names.

Re:LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after ... by sdiacom on Thursday November 17, 2022 @06:31AM (#33637487)
Per the Wikipedia article:

> User content in SSB is organized as an append-only sequence of immutable messages, where messages cryptographically sign adjacent messages for the purpose of guaranteeing unforgeabilitity of the sequences as they are replicated to other peers.

That's pretty much a blockchain. Of course, they don't call it a blockchain themselves, because the Scuttlebutt people are not running a grift, they're creating a communication protocol that happens to use cryptographic primitives similarly to how blockchains use them.

Re:LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after ... by xigoi on Thursday November 17, 2022 @06:44AM (#33637614)
Do the messages require computationally expensive proofs?
Re:LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after ... by sdiacom on Thursday November 17, 2022 @07:12AM (#33637858)
Thankfully, no. I don't think that's a requirement for a blockchain, though.
Re:LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after ... by hiq on Thursday November 17, 2022 @06:45AM (#33637623)
That's using a specific definition of a blockchain that differs significantly from e.g. Bitcoin and Ethereum which are two of the most popular ones and the ones commonly referred to, along with their decentralization properties. The Schneier post I linked explains fairly how these are not novel and have nothing to do with the current hype beyond the confusing naming.

Concretely, if Scuttlebutt uses a blockchain, then Git also uses a blockchain by a similar reasoning. I don't think the original post claiming that "there are no use cases for blockchains" was implicitly claiming that Git (or Scuttlebut) is not relevant software, just that they don't use a blockchain, because indeed they don't for any interesting definition of "blockchain".

Re:LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after ... by sdiacom on Thursday November 17, 2022 @07:18AM (#33637908)
I agree with you completely, the "blockchain" term is confusing, and by the definition I'm using, Git would also be a sort of blockchain. The more that blockchain (the grift) expands, the more that the meaning of blockchain (the technology) is diluted.

A key difference to me between Git and Scuttlebutt, which in my (most likely flawed) view makes Scuttlebutt "blockchain-er", is the distributed nature of it. You add a friend on Scuttlebutt, and this will fetch their content from any node, and all their friends' contents. It has an "automatic replication across nodes" aspect which Git does not have.

[Disclaimer: I haven't used Scuttlebutt in a long while, so I may be getting the technical details of the friends-of-friends-replication thing wrong.]

Re:LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after ... by maccard on Thursday November 17, 2022 @07:14AM (#33637870)
> That's pretty much a blockchain

Only if you remove all of the parts of a blockchain that make it a blockchain. The definition from wikipedia isn't a blockchain, it's a Merkle Tree. They're not the same thing - a blockchain _uses_ a merkle tree. The bits that are bolted onto the merkle tree are what make it a blockchain, and are the bits that don't provide value.

Re:LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after ... by emptysongglass on Thursday November 17, 2022 @06:34AM (#33637516)
I am not talking about something else. SSB is powered by a blockchain.
Re:LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after ... by hiq on Thursday November 17, 2022 @06:46AM (#33637624)
We're just arguing about definitions, see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33637623

This is fully addressed in Schneier's article.