Generals who oversaw Abu Ghraib are no different.

Pax Americana is definitely crumbling before our eyes.

It's ok for two different things to both be bad, we don't have to pretend they're the same.

I don't see much of a difference between the two. They're both institutional murder and torture.

There is action and there is the reaction. You could argue that the action is identical. But the reaction—internal, institutional, political—was and is not participating similar.

People in power will abuse power. That’s inevitable in any regime. What makes the difference is how they are held accountable, especially by their own regime.

They're similar in that they're both beyond the pale.

For example, Manadel al-Jamadi was murdered in detention, while being tortured by the US military. The people who murdered him then took "thumbs up" photos with his corpse.

No one was punished for his murder.

NSFW, his corpse is pictured on this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Manadel_al-Jamadi

Don’t know who is downvoting you. I wonder if the butcher is also employing people to monitor social media to influence discussions.

Like this? https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/09/technology/twitter-saudi-...

A former Twitter employee was convicted on Tuesday by a jury in federal court of six charges related to accusations that he spied on the company’s users for Saudi Arabia.

While at Twitter, Ahmad Abouammo, 44, managed media partnerships in the Middle East and North Africa. He developed relationships with prominent individuals in the region, receiving hundreds of thousands of dollars and a luxury watch from a top adviser to Saudi Arabia’s crown prince, Mohammed bin Salman. In return, prosecutors said, he shared the personal user information of dissidents with Saudi officials.

The jury convicted Mr. Abouammo of two counts of wire fraud or conspiracy to commit wire fraud, two counts of money laundering, one count of falsifying records and one count of acting as an agent of a foreign government without properly disclosing that work. It found Mr. Abouammo not guilty on five counts of wire fraud or conspiracy to commit wire fraud.

That is really scary. They probably have insiders in their payroll in every major tech company.

Why wouldn't they?

If you had a budget of ~1T for several decades how would you (acting as MBS) spend it all?

I just assume that once you get into the FAANG caliber of compensation in the US tech industry (and possibly well before that), that suddenly the walls, and everything else starts listening and glowing.

I didn't downvote the op. I downvoted you.

Having someone to disagree with your stance doesn't mean there's a conspiracy.

It’s probably because of the second paragraph. The first is a sentiment many people can agree with. The second paragraph, asserting not only that the U.S. is crumbling but that somehow retired generals working in SA is proof is utterly ridiculous.

Crumbling for sure. But incredible turn arounds have happened before. Consider the US posture at the end of the 1970s vs only a decade later.

While I'm in general agreement that we should stop treating Saudi Arabia like it's the ally we want it to be given their actions in Yemen, with OPEC and their direct ties to 9/11.

But your comment is particularly funny because you brought up NATO [1]:

> One typical example is General Adolf Heusinger, a career military officer who, with the outbreak of the Second World War, became part of the German headquarters field staff and helped plan the Nazi invasions of Poland, Denmark, Norway, France and the Low Countries. The Nazis perpetrated against Poland one of the worst crimes history has ever known. Poland suffered the largest number of casualties per capita of any European country, with a total of about six million people killed. Heusinger rose quickly through the Wehrmacht’s administrative ranks and in 1944 was appointed Adolf Hitler’s Chief of the General Staff of the Army.

> With the 1955 establishment of the Bundeswehr, the reconstituted West German Armed Forces, Heusinger returned to military service, and was appointed Lieutenant-General in 1955. In 1957, he was promoted to full general and named the first Inspector-General of the Bundeswehr. He served in that capacity until 1961. In 1961, Heusinger was appointed Chairman of the NATO Military Committee, making him the senior military spokesperson for NATO and in 1963 he also became NATO’s chief of staff, serving in that capacity until 1964.

There were a number of other ex-Nazis in NATO's ranks and leadership.

[1]: https://cpcml.ca/itn220328-tmld-art4/

Under both Obama and Trump the US provided *direct* logistical and targeting support for the Saudi bombing of Yemeni targets. Biden finally stopped it in 2021. The humanitarian catastrophe in Yemen would not have happened without U.S acquiescence.

Saudi Arabia is not a U.S adversary, it is an ungrateful client state and has been since Roosevelt.

> Pax americana is starting to crumble.

You mean Pax Israel is starting to crumble. Is it a coincidence that Yair Lapid is now advocating for a two state solution? They see the writing on the wall.