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Re:iPhones and action discoverability by BeFlatXIII on Saturday September 24, 2022 @09:18PM (#32968104)
I think you just articulated what my #1 blocker to mastering vim and/or emacs has been: they're both designed for the "mastery thorough thick manual" era. Dashing off to Google answers my immediate query, but often is far less instructive than a well-organized manual with an index at letting me discover the adjacent thing I actually need.

OK, that's my #2 blocker. My #1 blocker is that I am no longer 15 and have things to do other than just poke about until I master a new text editor.

Re:iPhones and action discoverability by taneq on Sunday September 25, 2022 @11:43PM (#32979155)
> My #1 blocker is that I am no longer 15 and have things to do other than just poke about until I master a new text editor.

100% this. Once upon the time my attitude would have been a bratty "you just don't want to do the work to master your tools!" My response to that now is "no the fuck I do NOT, I want problem number 8131 solved yesterday so I can move on to problem number 8132 which btw requires entirely different tooling."

Re:iPhones and action discoverability by BeFlatXIII on Monday September 26, 2022 @11:04AM (#32984068)
emacs and vim are tools that you'd use enough that mastering them is probably worth the time investment. However, it's 100% true that mastering every package your stack touches is impractical. Learn just enough to get the tests to pass and move on to the next bug.

I was lucky enough to have first encountered LaTeX and LilyPond while still in high school.

Re:iPhones and action discoverability by 9dev on Sunday September 25, 2022 @01:33AM (#32969184)
For me, those are ancient tools for ancient times, designed when things really were different. We have other capabilities now, nobody is forced to work on the CLI anymore - I also refuse to spend weeks to „master“ my editor. Typing code is literally the least bad thing slowing me down when creating software.
Re:iPhones and action discoverability by wruza on Sunday September 25, 2022 @06:01AM (#32970094)
“Ancient” with regard to a living thing is usually a characteristic that shows an ignorance of features and a lack of experience with dynamics of toolsets. Truly ancient (obsolete) things get lost to history.

We have other capabilities now, nobody is forced to work on the CLI anymore - I also refuse to spend weeks to „master“ my editor

I agree with all of that, but from the vim side of things. Although these are not my main concerns with organizing a development process, I find it troublesome to set up and tune a modern IDE into a useful state either, and refuse to do that unless it’s a workplace requirement.

Typing code is literally the least bad thing slowing me down when creating software.

Typing code in vim-insert or emacs is the same as in any other editor. You press keys, they show up on the screen. Press F1 and type a command. Press a shortcut to enter files pane and select a file to edit. Press C-K C-9 to expand all user folds. Install a plugin, map some keys and now you can set and cycle through bookmarks easily.

Re:iPhones and action discoverability by skydhash on Sunday September 25, 2022 @06:06AM (#32970108)
It’s not about typing faster. It’s about learning a language of editing. When you’re begin to be fluent in it, you will be communicating with the editor the changes you want to see. And it’s just a terse language that realizing what you want to actually do it and see it done take only one or two seconds.

I strongly believes the “Think about it” -> “Express it” -> “See it done” is much better the whole ballet your hand would be doing with the mouse and keyboard.