Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by anigbrowl on Friday September 23, 2022 @03:01PM
(#32955745)
The elaborate formalities of historical combat probably evolved as a way to minimize casualties. It's a pattern that appears over and over in military anthropology, where the goal of most conflict was to command good territory or carry off women. Going all-out to annihilate your enemy tribe completely was the equivalent of nuclear war.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by Wohlf on Friday September 23, 2022 @04:54PM
(#32956935)
It's also much deadlier for the winners to not let the opposing side retreat/surrender, if people feel trapped they'll fight to the death.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by WalterBright on Saturday September 24, 2022 @01:53AM
(#32960024)
Exactly.
I suspect that WW2 went on for an extra year because the Allies announced they wanted "unconditional surrender", which meant death for the leaders.
The Germans had a saying, "enjoy the war because the peace will be hell".
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by RalfWausE on Saturday September 24, 2022 @02:51AM
(#32960253)
Also a german saying: "Der Soldat der beizeiten flieht, der kämpft auch noch im nächsten Krieg"... if you flee in time you can be able to fight in the next conflict.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by renewiltord on Saturday September 24, 2022 @02:54PM
(#32965544)
An old saying from early in the first Millennium at least, through Menander apparently, but common in many cultures.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by kevinventullo on Saturday September 24, 2022 @11:55AM
(#32963869)
FWIW, the length of time between D-Day and the German surrender was less than a year.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by WalterBright on Saturday September 24, 2022 @02:13PM
(#32965206)
The Germans knew long before D-Day that they were going to lose.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by towaway15463 on Friday September 23, 2022 @06:03PM
(#32957657)
Ransom money and family relations or treatment of the hostages the enemy had were probably the big motivators.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by WalterBright on Saturday September 24, 2022 @01:50AM
(#32960015)
The reason for minimizing casualties was the armies consisted of paid mercenaries. Mercenaries had no interest in dying in combat, so it was maneuver to get the other side into a bad position, then they capitulate.
This all changed with conscription. Now, commanders could command vast armies of conscripts who were forced to fight, and the slaughter was/is tremendous.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by nazka on Saturday September 24, 2022 @07:32AM
(#32961555)
That’s interesting. Do you know where I can find more stuff about this? And the etiquette of war back then?
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by WalterBright on Saturday September 24, 2022 @04:07PM
(#32966141)
The period was the middle ages in Italy with its warring city-states. I don't have a reference handy, as this was told to me by my father (who had a PhD in history).
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by anigbrowl on Saturday September 24, 2022 @05:39PM
(#32966752)
*A History of Warfare' by John Keegan is a readable introduction to the combined history and anthropology of warfare, with a good bibliography.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by suoduandao2 on Friday September 23, 2022 @02:28PM
(#32955463)
'leapt on his charger' implies that he attacked very quickly, perhaps after the battle had officially started but both sides were still in fact glaring at each other and getting ready. I imagine it being a bit similar to a boxing match which begins when the bell rings, but opponents will typically touch gloves as a sign of respect before actually fighting. Sometimes a fighter will use this moment to sneak in an unexpected attack and catch his opponent off guard - well within the rules, but considered poor sportsmanship.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by anigbrowl on Friday September 23, 2022 @03:10PM
(#32955847)
They had already fought for several hours earlier in the day and then paused for lunch. After resuming, the English lost one of their leaders but kept fighting and bunched up tightly. As far as fighting on foot goes goes, this made it impossible for them to win but also impossible to defeat given the number of fighters available.
The modern equivalent would be ending a gun battle by driving an armored truck through the enemy group.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by towaway15463 on Friday September 23, 2022 @06:00PM
(#32957635)
Combat like this without reserve cavalry likely devolved into dismounted melee immediately after the first charge. They would have started mounted, charged with lances, became embroiled in close combat, eventually dismounting or being pulled off, then melee combat on foot.
The squire in question probably broke ranks and ran off and mounted his steed and then flanked his opens at full charge and just ran them over. That’s usually the job of reserve cavalry to smash formations of foot soldiers but they agreed to not have any reserves so it could be considered against the terms they agreed to even if he was taking part in the fight from the start.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by david422 on Friday September 23, 2022 @03:13PM
(#32955890)
Harrison Ford was originally supposed to do a giant sword fight. But then for several reasons, it was shortened and the outcome was much better:
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/general-news/raiders-...
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by peteradio on Friday September 23, 2022 @02:20PM
(#32955364)
> Guillaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaume ... de ... Montauuuuuuban!!!!!
> Goddamnit Guillaume...
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by 01acheru on Friday September 23, 2022 @07:02PM
(#32958094)
What are you citing? My brain kind of lights up but cannot figure it out.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by aegis4244 on Friday September 23, 2022 @08:02PM
(#32958506)
Leroy Jenkins. :)
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by peteradio on Friday September 23, 2022 @10:09PM
(#32959156)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLyOj_QD4a4
Makes me giggle every time.
Re:60 knights paused a war to fight a battle royale
by beckingz on Friday September 23, 2022 @02:35PM
(#32955519)
He had his chicken it was time to go!
> Armed at all points, and on our steeds—and Heaven defend the right!
The battle was decided by
> Breton squire Guillaume de Montauban leapt on his charger and rode straight into the English ranks
The outcome was
> Though his mounted charge may have represented a breach of etiquette, the outcome proved such a crushing blow that the English could not carry on and effectively capitulated.
Why is that a breach of etiquette if you're on the horse and you all agreed to be on your horses. But assuming for whatever sake, that this was a breach, that makes the whole story absolutely hilarious. It is reminiscent of the Indiana Jones scene where Harrison Ford pulls out a gun to shoot a guy who does sword tricks.
Hahaha, what a bunch of suckers.