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Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by itvision on Saturday August 06, 2022 @12:22PM (#32369407)
> Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux

On the server/router maybe. For IT pros maybe.

The desktop is a whole different matter.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by sgt on Saturday August 06, 2022 @12:32PM (#32369510)
On the desktop, Linux is going to be challenging anyway. Many people love that challenge and make it work, and that's cool. But my point is that if you can make it work on desktop Linux you will make it work on FreeBSD as well, given some decent skill.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by loeg on Saturday August 06, 2022 @12:56PM (#32369677)
> But my point is that if you can make it work on desktop Linux you will make it work on FreeBSD as well, given some decent skill.

As someone who has run Linux and FreeBSD desktops for years -- no, Linux on the desktop is actually quite a bit better and easier to use than FreeBSD.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by gtirloni on Saturday August 06, 2022 @02:39PM (#32370506)
> Linux on the desktop is actually quite a bit better and easier to use than FreeBSD.

As someone who actually started learning *NIX on BSDs and later switched to Linux, I think "quite a bit better and easier" is an understatement. I tried the latest FreeBSD last year on a not so recent Lenovo laptop and it was a horrible experience.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by caslon on Saturday August 06, 2022 @01:03PM (#32369733)
Desktop Linux is pretty comfortable and intuitive, actually. There's no challenge involved.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by sgt on Saturday August 06, 2022 @01:45PM (#32370090)
A guy I know (relatively skilled) spent a whole week setting up Linux on his laptop the other day. So I don't think it's always as predictable as to say there's never a challenge involved in 2022.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by prmoustache on Saturday August 06, 2022 @02:12PM (#32370307)
Not sure what do you want to prove with that anecdotal point. I've seen coworkers spend a month or 2 with both their new and old mac or windows laptops because they weren't seeing the end of migrating their stuff from one computer to another and setting up their dev environment.

Some people are just bad at this.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by phendrenad2 on Monday August 08, 2022 @02:31PM (#32389187)
Why are your anecdotes better than that post's anecdotes?
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by ooneeks on Saturday August 06, 2022 @05:47PM (#32371867)
Just install Ubuntu if you quite literally cannot grasp GNU/Linux. No, your "guy" is not "relatively skilled", that's an absurd claim when it took an entire week setting up Linux on a laptop. It has never, ever taken me more than an hour or two with mainstream distros, or more than 3 days max. for more complicated distros such as Gentoo or Arch - but the system would be minimally operational within a day, always. You would literally have to one-finger press your keyboard whilst also learning how to read for the first time simultaneously, to make the install of Linux on a LAPTOP last a week.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by donkeybeer on Sunday August 07, 2022 @10:25AM (#32376724)
Installation does not just mean finishing the setup from the livecd. We have to work at copying our apps, configs, etc and it can be a lot of "long tail" work to get things exactly as before.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by phendrenad2 on Monday August 08, 2022 @02:33PM (#32389206)
Out of curiosity, how hard would Linux have to be to setup for you to no longer define "relatively skilled" as "able to setup Linux in < a week"?
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by trelane on Saturday August 06, 2022 @02:15PM (#32370330)
He should try putting OSX on the hardware. Wouldn't even start to work.

Clearly OSX is not ready for the desktop yet.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by phendrenad2 on Monday August 08, 2022 @02:35PM (#32389221)
It's too bad Linux's success isn't defined as "Can be installed on as many types of hardware as OSX" then, eh?
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by unethical_ban on Saturday August 06, 2022 @02:26PM (#32370417)
I just installed Fedora 36 on my Thinkpad. It went pretty smoothly. Single monitor, AMD CPU/iGPU.

There are a few gripes about the discoverability of the keyboard shortcuts. Unity was good with this, holding down the Win/Meta key showed all the DE shortcuts.

Also, there is not an easy way to change certain settings (like system font!) without installing an obscure package "Tweaks" that should be built into the system settings.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by sgt on Saturday August 06, 2022 @03:02PM (#32370666)
Can you quickly try and connect to my 4K 60Hz monitor without the whole room breaking into laughter?
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by ooneeks on Saturday August 06, 2022 @05:50PM (#32371888)
Have you not ever used a Linux distro? I haven't had an issue with monitors since before Ubuntu 8. Seems ridiculous you're going to claim that Linux, which dominates the phone/handheld industry, would have issues in regards to using high resolution/high DPI monitors along with lower spec ones concurrently. I think of all OS's, my bet would probably be that this is a way bigger issue on Windows than on Linux or Mac.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by umanwizard on Saturday August 06, 2022 @07:53PM (#32372642)
What you’re saying is probably valid for a desktop (especially if it doesn’t use Nvidia), but laptops (especially Nvidia ones) are still far from perfect. Personal experience with Ubuntu on a recent Thinkpad:

* When using Wayland, until VERY recently (latest nvidia drivers), the entire system would freeze when hooking up an external monitor. Okay, no problem I’ll use X.

* Hygrid graphics just completely doesn’t work, loads of glitches, glacially slow framerates on external monitors, etc. Okay, I turn off hybrid graphics in the BIOS, but that absolutely trashes battery life.

* X does not let you run different scale factors concurrently. You can’t set your laptop screen to 2x and your external monitor to 1x. Wayland does let you, but see above.

* I have two 4K monitors hooked up to my laptop. Whenever I resume from sleep, there’s a very good chance that only one or zero of the monitors is detected. They both power on, but only one (or sometimes none) of them actually has a signal. Cycling power on the monitor usually fixes the issue. My coworker has a Thinkpad from the same line but a generation earlier, and it had the exact same problem, so this has apparently been around a while and still isn’t fixed.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by trelane on Saturday August 06, 2022 @09:19PM (#32373027)
> Personal experience with Ubuntu on a recent Thinkpad:

Well, that's your first problem. How does FreeBSD or OSX do on it? Maybe you should buy a Linux laptop to run Linux instead of slapping Linux on a Windows laptop and expecting it to work correctly.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by depressedpanda on Sunday August 07, 2022 @01:14AM (#32374080)
No, I'm pretty sure all his problems are due to Nvidia.

Try Intel or AMD; they are a lot more stable in my experience.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by ooneeks on Sunday August 07, 2022 @06:46PM (#32380671)
Don't Nvidia make open-source Linux drivers now? I honestly have not had graphical driver issues since... Well since a good while before SteamOS and such. I don't doubt you guys at all, but I only have "older" laptops that might have GPU issues in terms of overall Linux compatibility.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by umanwizard on Sunday August 07, 2022 @09:26PM (#32381574)
> Don't Nvidia make open-source Linux drivers now?

Yes, but only since very recently — AFAIK, most distros are not using the open-source drivers yet, as they don’t yet have feature parity with the proprietary ones.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by sgt on Sunday August 07, 2022 @09:03AM (#32376166)
I was referring to laptops, which most developers use these days.

umanwizard's reply is interesting.

Also - I have been using Linux for 26 years, if that matters. However, on the desktop I largely moved to macOS (then called OS X) in 2003.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by caslon on Saturday August 06, 2022 @03:34PM (#32370889)
Anecdotally, as a user of a different distribution and desktop environment, yes. Just Works.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by sgt on Saturday August 06, 2022 @04:57PM (#32371534)
If that's true then there's been substantial improvements on that front recently (which is good). As I recall, that was a tricky problem since your laptop screen likely runs another resolution, different DPI, etc so connecting to an additional screen makes things go haywire.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by caslon on Saturday August 06, 2022 @06:17PM (#32372084)
That's only with Wayland. If you don't use Wayland, the situation has been fine for a decade.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by umanwizard on Saturday August 06, 2022 @07:54PM (#32372647)
It’s the other way around. Wayland supports different scale factors on different monitors; X doesn’t.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by caslon on Saturday August 06, 2022 @08:26PM (#32372787)
Works on my machine, anecdotally; no Wayland, and an X window manager that hasn't been updated in a decade. Automatically resizes windows when I drag them to fit each monitor's DPI settings.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by sgt on Sunday August 07, 2022 @09:05AM (#32376180)
Btw, does it allow you to run different scale on the different monitors? It wouldn't really be feasible to run native 4k resolution on one monitor if everything will be tiny, so it needs to have scale. One monitor might run on 1x and the other 2x.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by caslon on Sunday August 07, 2022 @02:45PM (#32378696)
Yes, it does, as I said in the comment above. It resizes windows according to their DPI settings, to keep a consistent scale.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by sgt on Sunday August 07, 2022 @08:59AM (#32376139)
Glad to hear that. 2023, year of Linux on the desktop.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by caslon on Saturday August 06, 2022 @01:52PM (#32370153)
"Relatively" seems like it's doing a lot of work there.
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by umanwizard on Saturday August 06, 2022 @07:43PM (#32372605)
Ubuntu is clearly better for average people on the desktop than FreeBSD. (And I’d argue that macOS is in turn clearly better for most people than Ubuntu).

But FreeBSD is great as a desktop for tinkerers — if you want something that’s simple enough that you can actually understand how it works, and whose source code you can quite easily jump into, modify, and rebuild, it blows Linux out of the water.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by awuji on Saturday August 06, 2022 @01:11PM (#32369799)
I have been daily driving FreeBSD as a desktop since the last time this article was posted and I love it. It is super consistent and reliable, and after I got it set up, I don't have to worry about anything breaking. I can easily use it daily for coding and web browsing, and it feels as smooth and fast as a Linux setup on the same hardware.

That said, I still have a Linux system for things like gaming, Cuda, and containers. Though, as I never have time to game anyways, I could just use the Linux system as a server.

But, I've used Linux for 10+ years and it only started annoying me recently so I may also get frustrated with freeBSD eventually.

Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by iasay on Saturday August 06, 2022 @12:36PM (#32369543)
macOS is a fine Unix desktop to drive your FreeBSD servers from...
Re:Technical reasons to choose FreeBSD over GNU/Linux (2020) by oleleo on Saturday August 06, 2022 @02:30PM (#32370443)
Can you watch Netflix on FreeBSD yet? That was what prevented me from switching from Linux last time I tried.