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Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by bko on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:15PM (#31780387)
What other organization wouldn't let go of someone under these circumstances? Are there any employees that openly, pulicaly and very vocally criticize their leadership

Imagine working with someone like this? If you've been in an organization with people are constantly getting into flame wars about political issues, its incredibly distracting to those that want to get work done.

Some people buy the whole "we're a family" HR spin, but its not true. You're there to do a job and you're paid to do so.

Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by femiagbabiaka on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:20PM (#31780477)
> What other organization wouldn't let go of someone under these circumstances?

Any organization that's worth working at, obviously. And there are plenty of them.

Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by kube-system on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:27PM (#31780601)
The organizations that are worth working at don't have employees who have a reason to publicly criticize their leaders because their leaders effectively manage internal affairs internally.
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by fundad on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:57PM (#31781038)
Yeah people give him the benefit of the doubt that the is meeting his fiduciary obligations because he's CEO. They assume if the CEO does it, it's good for what he wants for his companies. We know it's more about his ego but are we going to argue that fiduciary obligation isn't enforced to people who are obviously part of a death cult?
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by femiagbabiaka on Friday June 17, 2022 @01:11PM (#31781209)
Yep, exactly right. Instead SpaceX gets Gwynne acting as Musk’s mouthpiece/enforcer. I would kill to know how she really feels about all this considering that the company is primarily her success.
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by bko on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:25PM (#31780559)
Give me an example of someone doing this in another organization. Would you be willing to share your organization and any criticism you have of leadership?
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by femiagbabiaka on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:31PM (#31780670)
https://www.theverge.com/2021/4/9/22375913/alphabet-employee...

I don't have any complaints about my current organization, but whenever I feel something has transgressed my personal code of ethics I'm first very vocal about it internally and if necessary externally. I've only ever left companies voluntarily after this, and most have made efforts for me to stay. And it's not like I've been working at the most progressive companies ever.. maybe just don't work at a Musk company.

Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by bko on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:46PM (#31780883)
Google has fired plenty of people for openly criticizing them. I never said an organization will necessarily fire someone for openly criticizing leadership. It's a case by case but within their right.

I personally think its obnoxious and counterproductive for someone to call management out publicly. That's no way to operate an organization. Its a sign that someone is toxic. Some orgs like Bridgewater tried that but that's def not a place I would want to work. The appropriate channels and structure exist for a reason. They're not perfect but I'm not arrogant enough to think I know better than everyone else

https://www.cnet.com/tech/google-fires-another-ai-researcher...

Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by femiagbabiaka on Friday June 17, 2022 @01:03PM (#31781121)
> I personally think its obnoxious and counterproductive for someone to call management out publicly. That's no way to operate an organization. Its a sign that someone is toxic.

Seems like we have come to the real root of things! We can agree to disagree.

Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by sanity31415 on Friday June 17, 2022 @01:14PM (#31781256)
I'd hate to work anywhere that tolerated this kind of narcissistic employee "activism", glad that companies are finally putting a stop to it.
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by femiagbabiaka on Friday June 17, 2022 @01:31PM (#31781486)
Interesting! What would you do if, for example, the leadership of your company said they were going to start implementing illegal policies preferring people of certain races or sexes for job reqs? Would you say nothing? Leave?
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by andrepd on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:33PM (#31780696)
I have privately and openly criticised my employer on several occasions, and never have I been sacked for that.
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by JumpCrisscross on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:47PM (#31780899)
> have privately and openly criticised my employer on several occasions

Huge difference between calling out issues and publicly demanding the CEO to be fired.

Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by kube-system on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:54PM (#31781011)
The letter being circulated doesn't ask for Elon to be fired.
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by fundad on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:47PM (#31780903)
Chances are it won't be found to be retaliation against workers organizing for working conditions with less drama. Even if it is and they get fined, for them it's just a fee.
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by stevenwoo on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:38PM (#31780770)
Basecamp and github most recently off the top of my head. IIRC one of Basecamp's founders is about the same ballpark as Musk and was called out to his face at a company meeting and on the other side Github kept the Nazi sympathizer who criticized the Jewish employee for complaining about Nazis, but fired the HR decision maker and tried to rehire the Jewish employee.
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by fundad on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:50PM (#31780952)
Yeah it's not about progressive vs conservative, it's industry vs workers. The managers who are good to their workers get weeded out before making it to the top.
Re:SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking... by runarberg on Friday June 17, 2022 @12:43PM (#31780837)
Common. If your CEO is making extremely inflammatory political statements publicly, and you don’t agree with those statements you are kind of in a dilemma. You either remain silent and and be perceived as broadly agreeing with—or at least tolerating—the CEO’s statements, or you speak out against them. In either case you are making a political decision.

Elon Musk put his workers in this dilemma and he should have expected a subset of them to speak out critically against him. I honestly don’t know other large organizations in our industry that is in the same situation, so there is really nothing to compare it with.