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Re:Germany paying $5.5B for Intel fab by eternauta3k on Tuesday June 07, 2022 @11:21AM (#31655686)
What company has the next-best litho machines after ASML?
Re:Germany paying $5.5B for Intel fab by Sakos on Tuesday June 07, 2022 @11:35AM (#31655878)
There is no alternative. Without EUV machines (produced solely by ASML), anything below 10nm is infeasible until we find a different way that works at scale.
Re:Germany paying $5.5B for Intel fab by voxic11 on Tuesday June 07, 2022 @11:25AM (#31655745)
> As of 2022, ASML Holding is the only company who produces and sells EUV systems for chip production
Re:Germany paying $5.5B for Intel fab by gpvos on Tuesday June 07, 2022 @11:46AM (#31656043)
Okay, so still: what is the company making the next-best chip making machines, using the next-best technology after EUV?
Re:Germany paying $5.5B for Intel fab by AlotOfReading on Tuesday June 07, 2022 @12:12PM (#31656477)
Nikon and Canon, in that order. Neither has managed to produce EUV machines, but they were somewhat competitive at higher nodes.
Re:Germany paying $5.5B for Intel fab by phkahler on Tuesday June 07, 2022 @03:00PM (#31658662)
That's really interesting, I had not heard those names in this space before. I would have expected Applied Materials. Maybe Nikon and Canon are suppliers of optics to the more industry specific companies?
Re:Germany paying $5.5B for Intel fab by AlotOfReading on Tuesday June 07, 2022 @07:53PM (#31661504)
Nikon actually supplied the machines for Intel through their 10nm debacle. Canon has completely retired into the low end market, but used to be massive. You're right that I forgot about Applied Materials.
Re:Germany paying $5.5B for Intel fab by dkjaudyeqooe on Tuesday June 07, 2022 @03:37PM (#31659111)
I think historically it's been a challenge mostly related to precision optics, given that semi production is more or less like exposing photographic paper from a negative, through a lens using a light source.

With EUV the challenge is the crazy difficulty of generating the required light source at the right intensity and focusing it. At that wavelength things behave differently, to say the least.

Re:Germany paying $5.5B for Intel fab by LeanderK on Tuesday June 07, 2022 @12:13PM (#31656493)
what if there are none that are really comparable? I don't think we can go back to those huge transistors
Re:Germany paying $5.5B for Intel fab by gpvos on Wednesday June 08, 2022 @06:08AM (#31665264)
Well, in that case I want to know, so that would also be a valid answer to my question.

You can do a lot with 6502s, which are still being made. (And we can probably make better than that. 80486s?)