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Re:Don't send to Gmail over IPv6 by SoftTalker on Friday June 03, 2022 @01:20PM (#31611107)
Why can I identify spam at a glance, with greater than 90% accuracy, from the subject line alone, and to Google it's an unsolved problem?

Google reads and indexes every email that they deliver to a gmail inbox. They probably have the worlds largest and highest paid staff of ML experts, and they resort to auto-flagging based on IP address?

Fix it.

Re:Don't send to Gmail over IPv6 by denton-scratch on Saturday June 04, 2022 @02:39AM (#31617669)
You can identify the spam because it's your inbox; you know what your goodmail is supposed to look like. For that reason you can use locally-trained naive Bayes on the client, and get good recognition (you don't need ML).

Honestly, the best filter in my experience is Spamhaus Zen; it spots most spam with very few FPs. It's an IP blocklist.

Re:Don't send to Gmail over IPv6 by Avamander on Saturday June 04, 2022 @08:59AM (#31619781)
If you use something like rspamd, then doing ML is not terribly hard. Then it becomes a problem of providing a proper teaching set. Combining RBL's (be it URI, IP or domain WL's or BL's) will help with that.

In the end it's still a hard problem, so takes a bunch of work.

Re:Don't send to Gmail over IPv6 by Avamander on Friday June 03, 2022 @01:25PM (#31611172)
> to Google it's an unsolved problem?

It's an unsolved problem for anyone.

> Why can I identify spam at a glance, with greater than 90% accuracy

I don't think you understand how terrible even 99.998% accuracy is at their scale.

> They probably have the worlds largest and highest paid staff of ML experts, and they resort to auto-flagging based on IP address?

You think they aren't using them for this? IP addresses very likely go into their model as well, when determining something is spam.

> Fix it.

They are and adversaries are breaking them again.

Re:Don't send to Gmail over IPv6 by kingjojo23 on Friday June 03, 2022 @03:39PM (#31612710)
> I don't think you understand how terrible even 99.998% accuracy is at their scale.

What does scale have to do with it, am I missing something? Wouldn’t a spam detection rate of 99.999% mean that only every 100000th spam mail would get through on an account basis, how’s that terrible?

Re:Don't send to Gmail over IPv6 by Avamander on Friday June 03, 2022 @04:48PM (#31613416)
> What does scale have to do with it, am I missing something?

The person I replied to said they can identify spam with 90% accuracy with a glance, my point was that it's abysmal as accuracy. Even orders of magnitude better it'd still be bad.

> Wouldn’t a spam detection rate of 99.999% mean that only every 100000th spam mail would get through on an account basis, how’s that terrible?

I didn't specify if it's per-account or a false positive rate, it's also actually not relevant to the point I'm trying to make.

When you receive billions of letters a month small errors start to matter and they're doing a better job than the person I replied to thinks they do.