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Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by marcosdumay on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @01:54PM (#30604313)
During a shock, when there exists sufficient productive capacity, price control together with forced production (as on fines for stopping it or worse) do really work.

For obvious reasons (and very good ones), this is something people won't accept unless the shock is really serious, like a war. Anyway, there isn't sufficient productive capacity either, so the shock importance is a moot point.

Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by cryptonector on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @02:03PM (#30604536)
> together with forced production

a.k.a. slavery

> For obvious reasons (and very good ones), this is something people won't accept unless the shock is really serious, like a war.

No kidding.

But again, it depends on what the goal of the price control is. In a war the goal is not to make life easier for the consumer -- the goal in that case is to get the consumer to stop consuming what the war machine needs for itself.

Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by marcosdumay on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @02:17PM (#30604896)
> a.k.a. slavery

On the case of war, conscription. It's disturbingly similar, but it's different. In peace times it's usually on the lines of "keep producing or your business will be closed", what is not that similar as the working people are not the ones facing the ultimatum (if it's ever done to a small company, then yes, it's like slavery).

> In a war the goal is not to make life easier for the consumer -- the goal in that case is to get the consumer to stop consuming what the war machine needs for itself.

Economies are large complicated beasts that move all kinds of products. When governments intervene, they do it in more than one way and with more than one goal.

Price fixing also goes with rationing so that the population stays fed.

Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by cryptonector on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @03:00PM (#30605935)
> > a.k.a. slavery

> On the case of war, conscription.

That works for getting labor for the military. It doesn't work for getting producers of things to produce more for less -- unless you put a gun to their heads, they won't do it, not even during war time.

Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by not2b on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @03:47PM (#30606656)
Counterexample: WW2, where most of US industrial capacity was repurposed to win the war. Producers got paid, but the amounts they got were limited. They didn't get to just name their price.
Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by cryptonector on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @04:04PM (#30606931)
They got paid more than their input costs. None were forced to go bankrupt, and most made a profit.
Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by not2b on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @07:28PM (#30609418)
Right, and in times where price controls were imposed this principle (you can't force people to operate at a loss, but you can limit price gouging) have been applied.
Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by jsmith99 on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @02:07PM (#30604639)
During a shock is exactly when price controls are most destructive as they prevent an efficient allocation of the scarce supply to those with the greatest need (assuming willingness to pay is a proxy for that).
Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by marcosdumay on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @02:22PM (#30605012)
> assuming willingness to pay is a proxy for that

Hum... Does that assumption ever hold?

Willingness to pay is a proxy for your early earnings and ROI. It correlates very weekly to anything else.

Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by pydry on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @06:29PM (#30608827)
>Hum... Does that assumption ever hold?

Never

Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by evandijk70 on Wednesday March 09, 2022 @02:45AM (#30611926)
In extreme cases, this does not work.

Eg. in a desert with a supply of 9 water bottles and 10 potential buyers. All buyers have the same need (buy a bottle of water or die of thirst). In an efficient market, the price of a water bottle would go to the amount of savings of the poorest person + 1 cent. The poorest person will die of thirst.

Re:America produces enough oil to meet its needs, so why do ... by chii on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @08:30PM (#30609953)
> the greatest need

and the greatest ability to pay. "Need" has a moral component, which the market does not price in.

But still i would argue that price control do more harm than good.