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Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by sokoloff on Friday January 21, 2022 @07:02AM (#30022298)
The web is our greatest achievement? Not language/writing, printing press, medicine, food production, sanitation, or harnessing electricity? I mean, the web is probably in the top 10, but I’d have to think pretty hard before concluding it was even top 5.
Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by throwawaylinux on Friday January 21, 2022 @07:08AM (#30022346)
Fire, metal working, domestication of animals, sailing and navigation, democracy, mathematics, physics, chemistry, the transistor, computing, radio, flight.

Probably not in the top 10 the more you think about it.

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by onion2k on Friday January 21, 2022 @08:34AM (#30023238)
Not language/writing, printing press, medicine, food production, sanitation, or harnessing electricity?

Those are innovations, not achievements. They happened largely by small groups in parallel around the world, with some small improvements shared between people when they met over hundreds or thousands of years. They're amazing things, but they're all examples of slow, incremental developments.

The internet is a truly global communications network that works ubiquitously everywhere that's been in development for less than 50 years. Humans have never achieved as much to do something so useful in such a short time ever before.

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by rakejake on Friday January 21, 2022 @09:01AM (#30023555)
While I understand the heft of your argument, I don't think food production and electricity generation can be categorized as simple innovations. Everything starts off when a small number of people work on something, and later spreads around through consensus. But crops are a basic necessity for survival so I feel it is unfair to bring it into this debate.

If anything, I would classify antibiotics, standardization of drug manufacturing, and scaling of energy (oil, nuclear power) as humanity's greatest achievements because all other achievements are made possible by (1) people being alive and well and (2) having the energy budget to carry out research and development.

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by dgellow on Friday January 21, 2022 @07:11AM (#30022366)
Internet, not the web, is for sure the greatest achievement of humankind so far if you consider the human effort and collaboration such a massive network requires and the multiplier effect it has on absolutely everything.
Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by manuelabeledo on Friday January 21, 2022 @07:52AM (#30022743)
> …the multiplier effect it has on absolutely everything

Isn’t this just a byproduct of the technology it is based on?

Commercial routes such as the Silk Road could be considered as the first massive, interconnected information networks.

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by toolz on Friday January 21, 2022 @08:08AM (#30022933)
Being able to communicate in real time anywhere in the world would seem to me, to be a force multiplier far greater than any other previous invention.

Further, access to the internet surely has spread the world faster than any other tech. Which in my mind highlights just how important and powerful the tech has proven to be.

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by ClumsyPilot on Friday January 21, 2022 @08:19AM (#30023073)
Lets look at real results

So invention of soap and hygene doubled life expectancy.

The industrial revolution / steam engine has taken us from 1% gdp frowth per ccenturyt o 3-5% GDP growth, so over 100x improvement.

Those are historic changes. What important metric has the internet increased at least by 50%?

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by toolz on Friday January 21, 2022 @09:39AM (#30024054)
Sure, since the invention of the internet extreme poverty has gone from 30-40% of the world to probably around 5% and there's a very strong trend increase as internet became more available.

Freedom indexes showing things like research and expression exploded with the internet.

I'd suggest these things are _far_ more important for humanity than growing a countries GDP, which may or may not result in life improvements for the majority of its citizens.

I would also nit-pick and entirely reject that hygiene doubled our life expectancy. Worldwide LE went from 30 to 60 over the course of many decades and no single region saw a double in less than a few decades. So this can't be attributed to any single event, much less something as discrete as soap/hygiene.

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by manuelabeledo on Friday January 21, 2022 @10:17AM (#30024608)
> Sure, since the invention of the internet extreme poverty has gone from 30-40% of the world to probably around 5% and there's a very strong trend increase as internet became more available.

It's highly unlikely that extreme poverty reduction is caused by the spread of internet. Also, your numbers are way off [1], as the current percentage is around 10%, down from 36% in 1990.

[1] https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/press-release/2018/09/19/d...

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by toolz on Friday January 21, 2022 @12:00PM (#30026298)
10% was 7 years ago in 2015 and 36% isn't the only estimate, there's another one for 44% at the same time IIRC

> It's highly unlikely that extreme poverty reduction is caused by the spread of internet.

what do you suggest happened 30-40 years ago that triggered this massive spread of wealth, then?

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by manuelabeledo on Friday January 21, 2022 @01:42PM (#30028050)
> what do you suggest happened 30-40 years ago that triggered this massive spread of wealth, then?

It doesn't really matter what I suggest. Correlation does not imply causation.

But for instance, in China there were 700 million of people living in extreme poverty in 1990, and that number went down to 200 million in 2008, and 7 million in 2016 [1]. Regardless, internet penetration rate in China was 23% in 2008, and 53% in 2016 [2].

From the article in [1], it is easy to deduce that most advancements in extreme poverty eradication come from similar contexts, countries with larger populations that have experienced accelerated growth in the past decades, mostly because of manufacture and exports, e.g. India, Vietnam, or Brazil.

[1] https://www.bbc.com/news/56213271

[2] https://www.statista.com/statistics/236963/penetration-rate-...

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by ClumsyPilot on Friday January 21, 2022 @02:13PM (#30028506)
"what do you suggest happened 30-40 years ago that triggered this massive spread of wealth, then?"

Look at GDP or poverty rate of any country, there is no 'bump' or infection point the year or even the decade internet was invented. You know what did create a bump? Decolonisation.

Conclusion: nothing happened, extreme poverty was receding for decades prior, and it's just the same trend continuing.

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by suifbwish on Friday January 21, 2022 @09:31AM (#30023950)
I would classify soap as more of a discovery than an invention. Soap self generates in nature in certain environments.
Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by purplevendetta on Friday January 21, 2022 @09:01AM (#30023552)
Conspiracy theories. Just kidding, of course.
Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by JKCalhoun on Friday January 21, 2022 @08:15AM (#30023031)
I'd put radio above internet. Electricity above radio. The plow above electricity.

If I kept going I suspect by the end of the day internet might not even make the top 100.

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by tonightstoast on Friday January 21, 2022 @07:48AM (#30022705)
I agree. IMO plumbing and agriculture are way higher than the internet. They’re what gave us more free time to build society.
Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by harryvederci on Friday January 21, 2022 @11:15AM (#30025577)
Didn't hunter gatherers have a working week of 10 - 20 hours? If free time is the measurement of success, that would make agriculture a pretty horrible invention.
Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by tonightstoast on Friday January 21, 2022 @11:43AM (#30026039)
Hunter gatherers spent 10-20 hours per week getting food - which was their work. I'm not sure where you are located but I spend 1hr/wk getting groceries. There are certainly parts of the world where people still walk miles for clean water but that's not most of the industrialized nations.

I'm not arguing that people work less, I'm saying humanity now has more "free" time to produce technology/innovate. In regards to the west, the lower classes do not get the benefits of this - but the upper class or researchers absolutely do get the benefit of not having to hunt and gather for food.

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by netcan on Friday January 21, 2022 @08:29AM (#30023189)
That's drab, IMO.

Plenty of ways to interpret that sentence more charitably. How about "we" meaning "we the people of our time."

Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by kken on Friday January 21, 2022 @12:41PM (#30027000)
Don't forget the Haber-Bosch process or process engineering in general.
Re:Yemen has lost internet after Saudi-led airstrikes by randomsilence on Friday January 21, 2022 @07:17AM (#30022394)
In theory, with the internet, civilization could go back to full decentralization. You need writing, printing, sanitation and food production to aggregate humans in cities to create a human network.

With the internet, people can be hunter gatherers and spread all over the world and still pool their knowledge to maintain the infrastructure. You still need electricity and machines, but the internet links it all together.

*edit: changed web to internet, along dgellow's comment