I think Game Pass has built up a helluva goodwill bucket, from talking with friends of mine.

The Games Pass is such ridiculous value that my "non-gaming" partner got a Series-S with Games Pass to play MS Flight Simulator, and as an aside, to have games available to myself and our kids (it was impossible to get the Series-X in the UK in the lead up to Christmas without paying scalpers).

I have a PS5 (sadly from a scalper), and I begrudgingly got Plus to fully experience the PvP aspect of Demon's Souls but the fact that it comes with a bunch of PS4 games for free, especially a few that I've been meaning to buy, makes it worth the subscription.

I doubt Sony would have done this without the pressure from the Games Pass.

I think Microsoft know that the PS4 won last gen on the basis of the amazing exclusives it had. I think that Microsoft is going to put a lot of exclusive pressure on Sony this gen with their buying spree (Bethesda etc), and while it is very hard to find time for gaming, I'm glad we have both systems in my house.

I liked the PS4 but even I feel like Sony didn't so much win the last generation so much as Microsoft lost it. Microsoft just never recovered from just how bad the XBox One launch was and Sony managed to win by pretty much doing nothing but releasing great exclusive titles. Sony right now seems to be fully into the hubris stage they were in when they made the PS3 and I feel like they are going to slowly lose market to XBox which has immerged from the disastrous XBox One humbled and with a greater desire to cater to their audience.

> Microsoft just never recovered from just how bad the XBox One launch

They just completely lost me to their branding strategy from that point. If I can't keep track of which console name does what, it's going to take something really compelling to make me pay attention. I'm still not actually sure what the PS5 competitor is even called.

The XBox branding department are big fans of The IT Crowd and completely unaware that it is a comedy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ab8GtuPdrUQ

It’ll still be a while. Xbox still is in such a distant spot everywhere outside America. Europe and rest of Asia for sure. I’m not considering Japan in this. It’s fine that Xbox will never sell there. I think you’re right they’ll climb back. It’s just such an uphill battle.

Edit: Hah okay yeah the PS3 and hubris…does mean things could change pretty quickly and world wide (outside Japan and maybe a few other East Asian countries), Xbox could be neck and neck if not winning out again. I’d rather not have either win out. Sega was never going to survive, we don’t have another gaming console company in sight unless Steam Deck counts, so the relative parity of Nintendo, PlayStation, and Xbox is nice. Throw in Valve for now too.

Things can change so who knows. I don’t enjoy casual mobile games. I do enjoy the Quest 2. I can only imagine how great VR gaming will be by the end of this decade. Then we have Roblox, a single game [platform], valued at roughly the same price as Activision without the acquisition margin.

> it was impossible to get the Series-X in the UK in the lead up to Christmas without paying scalpers

Not completely impossible. I managed to purchase an Xbox Series X directly from Amazon UK on 20th December. Amazon also had sufficient consoles in stock they were able to not run out for more than 12 hours [1].

[1] https://www.theverge.com/2021/12/23/22852161/xbox-series-x-a...

This feels a little like Amazon Prime in that the cost of the total bundled deal is technically good, except that I don’t really want everything in the bundle, and would rather receive much less value for only somewhat less money. It probably works for a lot of customers, but I really avoid as many subscription services as I can.

Even Game Pass without Cloud gaming is bargain. I surprised that it also come with cloud gaming for free.

I would have loved game pass when I was younger for the sheer number of games. Now personally it offers me the ability to try things out and not regret dropping money on those games. I don’t play nearly as many games as I used to, but paying $15 and playing Back 4 Blood with friends was great. And I didn’t care when we all got our fill of it because I got my moneys worth. Personally it’s a great alternative to pirating.

Game pass is a loss leader. They will jack the price once they crush competition.

That’s what everyone thought.

They actually reported profit with game pass.

Not according to Phil in Nov 2021

https://www.essentiallysports.com/esports-news-not-the-only-...

At 15 dollars per month, 18 million subscribers, that's 3.25 billion dollars. They bought Betheseda for 7.5 billion. So now they're in the hole 4.25 billion and they still have to pay to run an entire extra company.

Why would you report an acquisition's cost with the operating expenses of an ancillary service? You should compare the operating expenses of Game Pass with its revenues (i.e. Game Pass subscriptions), and you should compare Bethesda's acquisition cost + operating expenses against its projected revenues (i.e. Bethesda game sales/subscriptions. Apples to apples, oranges to oranges.

We could do that, but that would hide the big picture. As Phil himself said, it's not yet profitable. It's a loss leader. True cost of ownership!

You are trolling at this point. I know we are to assume good faith, but the way you’re writing your replies. Repeating this Phil stuff. Combining two completely different things…

It's all Microsoft! The only way you sustain an unprofitable loss leader is by spending money from other parts of the company. To push game pass, theyve been buying IP. What's confusing about that? To There's no need for debasing accusations.

That might all make sense if Bethesda didn't also bring them other revenue streams. I mean, Elder Scrolls Online alone brings in a completely separate subscription stream and cash shop.

You keep ignoring every one saying that Bethesda acquisition which was Zenimax being acquired was also bought for other things and they got other things as well.

Why would you count Bethesda? I don’t understand the rationale. It isn’t even like they are the same revenue stream.

The article you linked does not say anything while adding up its word count. It’s common knowledge gaming companies say consoles never make a profit (except Nintendo). Game Pass is a fledgling growing SaaS. Of course sustainable is the right term. Nothing News worthy.

It's an answer to the reply that said they were profitable. They're not. They're 'sustainable'. That's it.

Even if you want to be anal about this. Phil saying the words sustainable doesn’t mean it’s profitable or not. It is just him saying stuff to the public. As if any corporate exec is ever going to be truly honest in public.

Taking away PR words as fact is not sustainable. It doesn’t work.

where did you get 3.25 billion? is that a years worth of subscription income? Does game pass blow up after that or something? Have subscriptions just stopped, 18 million and ..... no more growth.

If they keep buying stuff, they're not gonna make any money. It is thus a loss leader, as Phil indicated.

You understand those things they are buying have value right? That they are not just throwing money into the void. Investing in future growth is what businesses does in a competitive environment. If they don't keep buying stuff their service will fail and they will lose everything they had invested to that point. Thats how you don't make money.

Microsoft is buying stuff. Game Pass isn’t buying stuff. Microsoft makes plenty of money. Notice how any one can decide where to draw the line of what is what.

Why do you keep bringing Phil up. A loss leader isn’t the same thing as a growing SaaS. You are putting words in his mouth while repeating Phil said this, said that.

Yes, Microsoft makes plenty of money, that's how they're able to run game pass as a loss leader. Literally the original point.

So then game pass doesn’t lose billions. It makes billions since Microsoft does. Using your logic of assigning expenses and profit any where