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Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by kelnos on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @06:02PM (#29899662)
I address this in my post: there's an extension, and there's nothing stopping Apple from implementing it, as Google has.

Any other features that are missing or sub-par in the RCS vs. iMessage equation is IMO trivial compared to the harm we have now of the lack of interoperability.

Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by threeseed on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @06:18PM (#29899861)
But if it's an extension to the spec then other client implementors don't have to support it. And then you end up with a lower common denominator effect where end to end encryption is no longer widely used.

That is by every definition worse than what we have today.

Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by kelnos on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @08:02PM (#29900930)
How is that any worse than iMessage degrading to the lowest common denominator of SMS/MMS? And SMS/MMS is a much lower common denominator than RCS.

Look, I'm not asking for the perfect messaging system here. Because we're never going to get that. I just want something secure and private, and that works by default. Agreed that other client implementors don't have to support E2EE, but Google does, and Apple certainly would, and that covers enough cases right now to make me happy.

I'd grudgingly accept an iMessage app for Android, or (better) iMessage integration with the stock Android app. But I'd much prefer a standard that isn't controlled by a single company's goodwill... goodwill that they have already shown is in short supply.

Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by threeseed on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @08:50PM (#29901289)
Right now though there is no one standard which is a good thing for competition and security.

And you want instead to move the world towards a single, insecure standard, dictated by carriers who have decades long history of (a) supplying data to governments, (b) selling data to random third parties, (c) intercepting messages for their own nefarious purposes e.g. advertising and (d) doing very little to secure and protect their platforms from abuse.

No thanks.

Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by sangnoir on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @09:59PM (#29901741)
> Right now though there is no one standard which is a good thing for competition and security.

There already is a standard, one which Apple falls-back to when messaging Android: SMS.

The would-be-dystopia you describe well in your second paragraph is not a hypothetical: that is the world as it is today with SMS; Apple could change that by switching to RCS + encryption extension and protect their users' privacy, but they won't because they view it as a competitive wedge (we know this due to the Epic lawsuit, as mentioned in TFA)

Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by magicalist on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @06:36PM (#29900059)
> But if it's an extension to the spec then other client implementors don't have to support it. And then you end up with a lower common denominator effect where end to end encryption is no longer widely used. That is by every definition worse than what we have today.

This is a pretty literal description of how iMessage interfaces with non-iPhones today though, so not worse.

Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by PlanckMeasure80 on Wednesday January 12, 2022 @07:17PM (#29914909)
It’s worse because people might actually use it. I currently use WhatsApp for my main contacts that are on Android.
Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by rswail on Wednesday January 12, 2022 @06:15AM (#29904865)
Other than RCS is tied to the 3/4/5G carrier networks and cant work over other media or physical protocols. It's more of the same bullshit layers on top of GSM instead of messaging being independent of the device.

iMessage is tied to your Apple ID, not your phone number or IMEI.

Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by aspenmayer on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @06:54PM (#29900220)
RCS e2e can be disabled by anyone with your phone number and technical ability/means to sim swap. There’s a public site to do this:

https://messages.google.com/disable-chat

Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by dividuum on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @07:33PM (#29900616)
Maybe I’m misunderstanding the implications, but isn’t the mechanism mentioned below the exact same thing for iMessage? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29899880
Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by kelnos on Tuesday January 11, 2022 @08:03PM (#29900942)
If someone already has managed to swap/clone/steal my SIM, them being able to disable RCS on my number is pretty low on the list of problems I am going to care about.
Re:Google says iMessage is too powerful by aspenmayer on Thursday January 13, 2022 @06:56AM (#29919724)
I’m pointing out flaws with the implementations of both iMessage and RCS, not critiquing your own personal opsec.

Group RCS isn’t e2e, unlike iMessage. That’s the main point.