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Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by martin_a on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @07:48AM (#29565237)
Maybe I'm "spoiled" because in Germany there's a need to publish an imprint on all websites that are somehow "commercial" (having ads on it would be enough), but this is highly "dubious".

No contact information (as in "who runs this?") is provided on the site. Privacy policy is not GDPR compliant (no contact information provided), no names, nothing.

This might be fine for a personal blog, but for doing business this is (at least for me) a no-go.

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by maltfield on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @12:00PM (#29568581)
Hi martin_a, I'm Michael Altfield. I started the BusKill project in January 2020 with the following article on my blog:

* https://tech.michaelaltfield.net/2020/01/02/buskill-laptop-k...

The above article front-paged on Hacker News, and I got a lot of people asking me how they could buy one and use it in on Windows and MacOS. Over the past year, many people have contributed in porting it to those platforms (I originally just designed it for myself, and I use Linux).

The BusKill project is not owned by me. All our work is open-source, and it's owned by the community. As such, I don't put just my name on it because it's not just my work. But if you dig around, you do see my name pop-up in a few places.

The list of contributors can be found on our documentation's "Attribution" section.

* https://docs.buskill.in/buskill-app/en/stable/attribution.ht...

The main website is mostly just a landing page, blog, and a store so people can buy with cryptocurrencies and Tor since CrowdSupply doesn't run an Onion Service and doesn't accept crypto payments.

Not everyone who has contributed to the BusKill project is still active, but some of us are. You can find our names & photos at the bottom of the Crowd Supply campaign page:

* https://www.crowdsupply.com/alt-shift/buskill

Contact information is provided on the website. There's a link to it in the Footer* and on the GitHub page. Not sure how I can make that more clear:

* https://www.buskill.in/contact/

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by Symbiote on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @01:19PM (#29569616)
I'm not familiar with the German rules, but GDPR Art. 14 §1 says:

> Where personal data relating to a data subject are collected from the data subject, the controller shall, at the time when personal data are obtained, provide the data subject with all of the following information:

> (a) the identity and the contact details of the controller and, where applicable, of the controller’s representative;

Usually, these contact details are in the privacy policy.

It's certainly unusual for a website to omit this, and in most cases I wouldn't buy from a site where it's missing. In this particular case, maybe it's less strange.

However, I still wouldn't order without knowing from where the package will be sent. Something from Estonia arrives here without any import taxes, something from outside the EU can do (the CrowdSupply site says they handle VAT), but can also attract high processing fees.

https://gdpr-info.eu/art-13-gdpr/

(Note I'm not interested in buying a BusKill; I'm just procrastinating.)

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by maltfield on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @01:27PM (#29569734)
All orders are handled by CrowdSupply (via Mouser). They handle shipping, VAT, import taxes, etc.

It certainly added cost to the final product, but I figured it was more fair & transparent to everyone to set shipping to $0 internationally (I hate it when you finally make it to payment and only then learn shipping is $20 :/).

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by Symbiote on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:23AM (#29565533)
It seems to be from (or in partnership with) https://www.altshift.in/ in Estonia, leading to https://twitter.com/MichaelAltfield
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by maltfield on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @12:02PM (#29568617)
Yes :) BusKill is an open-source project. AltShift is my company.
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by thargor90 on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @07:58AM (#29565316)
Yes, we are spoiled.

I'm not sure it's even possible to have a valid contract with an unknown party...

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by martin_a on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:32AM (#29565627)
I don't think it is. Neither in B2B and especially not in B2C. Although I think the consequences would mostly be worse for the customer, not the seller.
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by FDSGSG on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:29AM (#29565597)
"Operator of buskill.in" does not seem like an unknown party?
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by martin_a on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:33AM (#29565635)
It is. What's the postal address of the "operator of buskill.in" so I can file claims with him?
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by FDSGSG on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:41AM (#29565741)
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by martin_a on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:45AM (#29565798)
You seem to misunderstand what a postal address is.

The provided information on this website is not enough to do legally binding business (at least in some parts of Europe, it's not only Germany).

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by FDSGSG on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:46AM (#29565812)
In Germany you can enter into a verbal contract without any exchange of personal details. Why would a website be treated differently? I'm curious.

As far as I understand German law is very flexible about what constitutes a valid legally binding contract.

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by martin_a on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @09:21AM (#29566280)
Chapter 2 and 3 of the "BGB" contain several paragraphs which define legal rights and obligations for doing business via the internet or telephone.

§312f for example defines that customers must receive "a copy of a contractual document signed by the contracting parties in such a way that their identity is identifiable" (translated via DeepL).

A simple mail address is not an identity in German law, especially not when doing business with B2C as you always have a 14 day period to cancel your order (except for downloads and various, special products).

edit: If you want to cancel, you must be able to do so via (offline) mail, too.

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by FDSGSG on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @09:29AM (#29566381)
Sure, they're not following the rules. Why would that affect the validity of your contract with them if you purchase good from them? Why would this contract not bind the seller?
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by paulcole on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @07:53AM (#29565290)
Would you be happier if the site prevented you from viewing it?
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by dspillett on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:02AM (#29565354)
I would. It would save me the time spotting the red flags and backing away anyway.

Though a couple of relevant regulations state this should not be done, and no site is going to send away a potential customer by saying “we don't want to follow your laws/regulations so can't do business with you” when they can instead just get away with just ignoring, or in the case of sites run from elsewhere in the world claim to have no no knowledge of, those regulations.

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by paulcole on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:18AM (#29565492)
> no site is going to send away a potential customer by saying “we don't want to follow your laws/regulations so can't do business with you”

Many local US-based TV news/newspaper sites do this albeit with a slightly more opaque message. And customer still mostly fits because these sites are ad-supported (usually with a mix of local/non-local ads.

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by martin_a on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:28AM (#29565578)
It's not about viewing/trying to track me, but we are talking about somebody trying to sell me something. Would you feel fine paying around 100 bucks to... well... whom?

Just a website with no contact information, no names, adresses, business registration, whatever?

As far as I can see, this could very likely be a scam of some sort, because anybody who's into doing "real", honest, business would be fine with giving his name and address.

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by paulcole on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:57AM (#29565972)
> Would you feel fine paying around 100 bucks to... well... whom?

I’d feel fine deciding if I feel fine.

That’s also why I have a credit card. I can get scammed and not be out $100.

Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by martin_a on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @09:25AM (#29566335)
Ok, so you get the item and it explodes in your face. Whom do you sue?
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by paulcole on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @09:55AM (#29566735)
Probably nobody!
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by martin_a on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @11:35AM (#29568207)
And you don't think there should at least be some possibility to hold someone liable in case something goes _terribly_ wrong?
Re:BusKill – A USB kill cord for laptops by paulcole on Wednesday December 15, 2021 @08:57PM (#29573956)
Yes, but I’m also aware that the possibility is roughly 0% if a person is truly determined to run a dangerous scam, regardless of what regulations are put in place.