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Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by Syonyk on Monday November 15, 2021 @12:16PM (#29229756)
Anyone who would know the fine grained differences is almost certainly NDA'd up quite tightly.

But it's likely things like different core counts, frequency performance curves, perhaps more or different memory/IO controller counts, perhaps instruction extensions of some particular interest (I'd wager BF16 was available in data center SKUs long before consumer SKUs), etc.

It's nothing radical, but if you're going to buy an awful lot of them and want something slightly custom, Intel will definitely do that for you.

Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by wolf550e on Monday November 15, 2021 @12:27PM (#29229903)
It's unlikely a different die (silicon chip), so the usual number of cores and usual size of caches, and it's unlikely that AWS gets a secret x86 instruction unlockable via msr or something like that. It's probably just constants for the frequency scaling (e.g. all cores and single core turbo).

Cloudflare mentioned they use a custom Intel SKU on their blog, and they're not as big as AWS.

Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by ghbe44 on Monday November 15, 2021 @01:03PM (#29230361)
I’m familiar with Google’s custom SKUs, and I assure you they’re unique enough to experience microcode bugs nobody else on the planet ever hits. There was a weird FDIV one back in the day that wasn’t the same FDIV bug that hit us all a long time ago. Cloudflare isn’t really at that customization table.

Your take sounds accurate for non-FAANGs (and a couple of those). For Google, not so much. There is a lot of custom acceleration and such that isn’t available to any other customer, and a nearby commenter is right, every detail about them is locked behind a very strong NDA. I’ve heard thirdhand AWS does indeed have custom instructions in the virtualization extensions stuff, but don’t know if that’s true.

Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by monocasa on Monday November 15, 2021 @02:02PM (#29231194)
My understanding is that Google's SKUs are the same die. Non Google versions just have the Google specific silicon fused off, or require a MSR knock sequence to turn on.
Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by ghbe44 on Monday November 15, 2021 @01:08PM (#29230439)
> I'd wager BF16 was available in data center SKUs long before consumer SKUs

Right you are, Ken.

Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by javajosh on Monday November 15, 2021 @12:26PM (#29229890)
What kind of levers do big ISPs/cloud providers want over their CPUs, other than the basic efficiency gains we all want? Isn't it risky doing any customization since you don't get commodity pricing?
Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by to11mtm on Monday November 15, 2021 @12:39PM (#29230057)
> Isn't it risky doing any customization since you don't get commodity pricing?

Depends on how many you order and how reasonable the customization is. Like, what if I wanted a 10,000 38 core Xeons with a 2.5GHz Base clock and 3.5GHz Turbo clock? Such a part doesn't exist, yet sits smack dab between two existing Models, the Xeon Platnium 8368 and 8368Q. Assuming yields are already good enough, that might be the sort of thing a CPU maker will do. (Might need more than 10k units though, IDK.)

Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by baq on Monday November 15, 2021 @02:43PM (#29231731)
I'd wager Pat doesn't get out of bed for 10k units and neither does Lisa.
Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by swiftcoder on Monday November 15, 2021 @01:32PM (#29230770)
At AWS scale you can feasibly just buy up the entire run of chips. What's a few million CPUs more or less between friends?
Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by mywittyname on Monday November 15, 2021 @02:01PM (#29231181)
Additionally, Amazon is absolutely the type of company to create their own x86 processor if Intel/AMD are unwilling to make some customization.

Intel does not want to be competing with an Amazon Basics processor.

Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by swiftcoder on Tuesday November 16, 2021 @03:09AM (#29238123)
They already have pretty significant investment in their own ARM-based chips for servers. Given Apple's recent success in x86 emulation on ARM, I doubt it's worth the trouble of directly competing in the x86 arena.
Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by Grazester on Monday November 15, 2021 @03:19PM (#29232169)
You basically need a license for X86 from Intel for this. Do you think x86 is open source!
Re:Blacksmith – Rowhammer bit flips on all DRAM devices toda... by folmar on Monday November 15, 2021 @07:22PM (#29234890)
The usual line of operation is to include VIA in the operation.