> They're subsidised by the game prices. You still pay for it in the end.

How much is a half-decent game PC ? €2000 ? Compare to a €500 console. For €1500 I can buy a lot of 'overpriced' games.

2 yrs ago i would've said 800€.

currently it would be 1.5k+€, but thats because of the silicon shortage and scalpers. and fwiw, a ps5 was going for 1.4k just a few month ago too.

Depends what matters to you. Do you care a lot for graphics? I can run nearly every game I care about on a laptop, since I care about gameplay like older emulator, indie games such as into the breach don't need good graphics, AoE II and SC are way more fun than ray traced shooters to me. For a cheap PC a 3400G APU can play GTA5 pretty well, and emulate PS3 games, nothing high spec just a CPU+GPU combo chip for $150 that will play older games, not lock games by console, and run PC software. Lots of great free games on PC like cave story exist too, not to mention the granular settings to games that don't exist on console, free mods to make games like Skyrim keep it modern, the existance of mods for games like Fallout or GTA5 make console games less full featured and unappealing unless you want to be locked to whatever they think is best for you. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0p5fbW5odY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yxPtHuyPJo If you want the latest AAA games, consoles are cheaper unfront costs, more expensive in the long run, and you have less freedom to run cool stuff on the games.

> I can run nearly every game I care about on a laptop, since I care about gameplay like older emulator, indie games such as into the breach don't need good graphics,

If that's what you care about then buying a modern console is a terrible idea, however you can buy a "retro" console (xbox 360) with dozens of games ver practically nothing (The first match on gumtree near me was a 360, 2 controllers and 35 games for £60)

But my PC can run PC native games, console emulators and upscale the graphics to make them look better on top of running programs. A 360 is limited to 720p, slow discs, proprietary slow HDD, and RRoD (I killed 2 360s when I had them due to the poor quality heatsink).

On PC they even have BotW DLC. https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2021/03/introducing_second... there’s no comparison for functionality.

The new Xbox can emulate (very poorly, less than a weaker computer can, but it’ll get better) too, it’s why the xbone with dev mode for homebrew was never hacked. https://www.ggrecon.com/articles/emulate-playstation-2-xbox-...

If I had to buy a console, form factor is the most important, I love my PSP. Could play NES, some SNES and very slow N64, perfect compatibility PS1 emulator, GB+GBC,GBA and of course PSP games. The homebrew on it for apps was amazing too with music players, ebook readers, cheats for every game, ability to change clock for battery life or performance, really a game changing device.

A half decent PC is in the 800€ to 1000€ range. If you're willing to take some graphical downgrades you can do it for 600-800€ too.

How many games can you buy for 500€ max? About 10 or so. Maybe.

You're comparing full price console games to free PC games. There are numerous games on consoles that cost less than €50, and buying the latest AAA releases on PC will cost you more than €50 too

How many free Console games are there? Much less than PC.

It's entirely fair as there is more possibility of free PC games, or them being of negligible cost since you pay lower platform fees.

This is in addition to the opportunity costs you incur of not buying a PC or having a lower powered PC as a PC can be used for other things (ie, office work, taxes, other productivity tasks).

In absolute numbers there are more free games on PC (see itch.io) yes but that kind of doesn't matter. If your game choices are purely driven by cost then a second hand laptop with f2p games is going to be the cheapest approach. If you exclusively want to play f2p games, then a cheap PC or a cheap console doesn't really matter. Buy if you're going to be buying a handful of new releases a year, the difference is more like €10 per game rather than €50

> since you pay lower platform fees

The platform fees (not required by the way) are roughly the cost of one game per year, if not cheaper. Gamepass being a very different discussion (and is available on PC too)

> This is in addition to the opportunity costs you incur of not buying a PC or having a lower powered PC as a PC can be used for other things (ie, office work, taxes, other productivity tasks).

I don't know about you but I don't want my work PC to be where I relax in the evenings, and many people don't want their employers software or information on their personal devices. I also live in a country where I don't have to fill in my own taxes, and almost all of my personal computing needs are met by my phone.

I didn't say you'd have to buy a workplace PC with gaming capabilities, there is plenty of opportunities for a PC to be productive outside work and gaming (such as commenting on HN).

I can do all of those things on my phone (and I do!)

Not all things are quite possible on a phone or as comfortable as you could do them on a PC (I couldn't imagine coding on a phone).

And things aren't always as comfortable on PC as they are on a console. I would much rather the streamlined experience and guaranteed compatibility of a console for playing games, in the same way you would rather a PC for coding over a phone.

I'd love to see people doing their taxes on their console, since by that argument it would be more streamlined.

>This is in addition to the opportunity costs you incur of not buying a PC or having a lower powered PC as a PC can be used for other things (ie, office work, taxes, other productivity tasks).

Work related stuf I do on my work-provided MacBook Pro, that costs me €0. For browsing the web, e-mail and taxes I just use my iPad.

An iPad costs non significant amounts of money and not everyone is privileged enough to get a MacBook Pro for personal work from their employer.

> An iPad costs non significant amounts of money

Less than a PC

If you want to play the kind of games you'd play on a console in a similar quality, your figures will only pay for the GPU, and that just barely. The prices are completely insane right now, PC gaming is not very affordable today.

And PC games also cost money, at least if we're talking about similar types of games as on the consoles.

You can definitely get a GPU for affordable prices if you're willing to wait. The insane prices apply if you want a GPU now.

Also keep in mind that consoles are subject to the very same price increase, it's nearly impossible to obtain a console for the advertised price.

I got a PS5 months ago for the regular price (400 EUR for the digital-only version), and I didn't put that much effort into getting it. A 3060 would be at least 700 EUR right now.

And the GPU prices have been rather expensive, if not as outright insane as right now for years. So PC gaming in general has become less attractive from a financial point while console prices are pretty much the same (though with some difficulty in getting them, for sure).

You don't need a 3060, you can simply get a GPU from a few generations back. You can get a Vega 56 for about 300€ which will play most games in high quality settings without any issues.

Same for all other components, it's no longer true that you need current-gen technology to be able to play with Graphics put on High.

That's still 3/4 of the price of a new console for a used 4 year old GPU. And you still won't be able to match the graphics quality of a PS5 in new games.

> And you still won't be able to match the graphics quality of a PS5 in new games.

And the PS5 won't be able to match the PCs capability of doing productive things when not gaming.

> You can get a Vega 56 for about 300€

No, not really.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_nkw=vega+56&_saca...

The real question is “how much is an equivalent game PC” because consoles do not perform anywhere near the level of half-decent game PCs.

"it's complicated" - links below. Right now the GPU market is screwed so you would spend more on the equivalent GPU than the entire rest of the hardware, but a $400 GPU (3060Ti) theoretically, plus the rest of the components, (CPU, motherboard, ram) peripherals (you get a £50 gamepad free with your console), software licenses (a legit windows license is not free)

[0] https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2021-call-...

[1] https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2020-assas...

You really don't pay more for games or certainly don't have to. Farcry 6 is $60 on PS5 and it's $60 on PC, same with Forza Horizons 5 and as far as I'm aware pretty much every new release. PSN and Xbox Live run similar sales to Steam and often the same games go on sale for the same price at the same time. Plus sometimes there is very good deals at retail or on the used market that just have not existed as an option for PC gamers for like 15 years.

It is also a huge kinda expensive PITA to setup a PC to handle Blu-rays and do Netflix and YouTube as well as a console. UHD drives are not cheap and you need paid software like PowerDVD to actually watch the disc. Getting a good remote interface is tough and when swapping between games, blurays and Netflix/YouTube and games requires entering mouse land. On console its all designed to be used from the couch and works well that way and you can easily get a compatible remote for $20-30 if your TV's doesn't work over HDMI CEC.

> You really don't pay more for games or certainly don't have to. Farcry 6 is $60 on PS5 and it's $60 on PC,

But subsidizing doesn't necessarily mean unequal pricing. It does not follow from equal pricing that a part of the $60 for a PS5 game didn't go into subsidizing the platform. For example, for all we know, a comparable amount of money for the PC game could have gone into extra development and QA effort necessary to support the more varied PC ecosystem so in the end the prices could be the same anyway, even without the game vendor willing to give up some profits for one or the other.

> You can use a PC in the same way. If you position it well, you can even have a dual purpose work/entertainment PC.

Not without significantly more work. A console you just plugin to your TV and you're good to go, with a PC you want to use for both work and entertainment you'll need to finagle all sorts of things. One major hurdle I've yet to overcome seamlessly is playing on my TV/Home Theater from a computer in my office. When I game I prefer to get full immersion, but there really aren't any great, easy to use solutions that allow such a setup. I could get a separate computer for the Home Theater purpose, but now again it's easier/cheaper to just get a console.

> They're subsidised by the game prices. You still pay for it in the end.

Initial game prices can be higher, but you can sell the games. Here in Australia it's common for new games to be $100 on console and $80-90 on PC. A month after release I can still sell a console game for $80, and often do, since I prefer single-player adventure/RPG type games which I will take 5+ years to replay if I ever do. That effectively means that games cost me $20 to play on a console or $80-90 to play on a PC. I prefer playing on PC for all the other reasons but it's really hard to justify the extra cost now that used PC games are no longer a thing.

>You still pay for it in the end.

Only if you buy new games at launch.

Consoles still have physical media, so from few days to few weeks you can grab games at a large discount.

It's true over the whole population - it's known that the hardware is discounted. You can play the price game of course, just like you can buy discounted steam keys or wait for sales, but on average people don't seem to do that.

The hardware is discounted at launch. For the PS4 and PS5 the consoles have sold at a loss for less than a year.

The cost of new releases on steam or the epic store is very close to the cost of a new release on console, so if you are jumping on new releases straight away the savings are very very slim