News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by josephg on Sunday November 07, 2021 @06:55PM (#29144781)
That doesn't mean linux is any better. I built a brand new ryzen x5800 machine late last year, running linux mint. When I first built it, the computer has had duplicate unremovable mouse cursors appearing on the screen. And my trackpad sometimes randomly became unresponsive (or one time, the up and down directions flipped!). And neither suspending nor hybernating worked - the machine wouldn't come back up.

All these problems have since gone away thanks to software updates and (importantly) a BIOS update. It turned out my USB controller wasn't being configured correctly by the motherboard. If I didn't happen to check for BIOS updates, I'd still have lots of problems.

And that was still a better experience than the HP laptop I bought a couple of years ago. That laptop had so much HP crap preinstalled that it sat on 30% CPU usage at all times out of the box. The biggest offender was some HP process doing microphone noise reduction. It ran all the time regardless of whether or not the microphone was being used - and utterly demolished the machine's battery life.

Apple is far from perfect, but they have a better reputation than most vendors for a reason. And their technical support is are excellent. I've had thousands of dollars of free hardware repairs & replacements over the years when things have broken in my apple machines. I wish they didn't break so much; and I wish they prioritised fixing software bugs over adding features internally. (APFS aside, I would trade the last 5 years of macOS features for better stability and performance in a heartbeat.) But there's a reason they're so well liked on HN. They're still pretty excellent in comparison to the competition.

Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by ricardobayes on Monday November 08, 2021 @03:44AM (#29147284)
Tell that to my tech lead who spent more than 8k buying and repairing his macbook due to constant motherboard issues. I love macs but don't dare to try them due to soooo many people in my circles seem to have very frequent HW issues with them. It seems to be either in the shop being repaired or having issues with connecting bluetooth stuff. I'm used to Thinkpad reliability so not looking forward to trade that up for some pretty pixels. My lenovo laptops had 0 issues in the past ten years. Zero. But now I'm web development and I need a mac for Safari to test locally.
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by ehutch79 on Monday November 08, 2021 @11:53AM (#29151246)
I manage a fleet of macs. I have not seen any issues like that. I'd ask what your friends are doing to their computers to be seeing such a disproportionate amount of hardware issues.
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by leephillips on Sunday November 07, 2021 @07:00PM (#29144807)
How well does macOS run on your home-built Ryzen machine?
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by josephg on Sunday November 07, 2021 @07:23PM (#29144946)
Huh? What point are you trying to make? I don't care how well macOS runs on my machine. I care how well any given computer gets out of the way and lets me get my work done. Today that means intellij, the rust compiler, firefox and nodejs. I want to spend my day working. Not futzing around with HP bloatware. Not rebooting due to apple memory leaks. And not guessing why my keyboard needs to be reconnected.
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by leephillips on Sunday November 07, 2021 @07:37PM (#29145044)
In your story, you built a machine, and Linux didn’t work well on it at first. Later, it worked fine. Meanwhile, macOS never did and probably never will run on it. And you introduce this story as an illustration of how “Linux isn’t any better.” So, to borrow your words: Huh? What point are you trying to make?
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by josephg on Sunday November 07, 2021 @07:57PM (#29145145)
In my story linux didn't work well at first. Then with some time and work, it worked fine. An HP windows laptop didn't work well at first - but after I spent some time removing the HP bloatware, it worked "fine". This article says that mac laptops aren't working well because of memory leaks. But in a few months Apple will probably fix their software bugs and they'll work fine too.

You said:

> The [mac users] that don’t complain have low standards

I agree with you. I'd go even further and say most users have low standards, because the out-of-the-box experience with most modern computers is pretty bad. Apple users should absolutely complain more when the out-of-the-box experience with their computer isn't perfect. We all should.

Apple customers keep buying apple computers despite their issues not because we have low standards. We do it because the alternatives are even worse.

Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by leephillips on Sunday November 07, 2021 @08:40PM (#29145381)
“most users have low standards”

I think you’re probably right about this. It’s like we’ve been trained to have low expectations.

Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by deltaonefour on Sunday November 07, 2021 @09:55PM (#29145765)
As an avid linux user I can tell you. Linux users aren't "trained" to have low expectations. They are trained to be masochists that enjoy pain. The raw amount of configuration, fixes and setup work that has to go into making some linux distros work is astronomical.

If nonlinux users are trained to have low expectations, Linux users are trained to rape themselves constantly.

Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by jokethrowaway on Monday November 08, 2021 @01:22PM (#29152382)
I see your point of view a lot but I don't think configuring a system is that hard and I think it's preferable, compared to have tons of complexity preconfigured without your knowledge.

Here's my experience with Arch Linux: 1) You install what you need to install 2) You read the doc and configure to your liking, learning what the system can and cannot do and how it works with everything else 3) Things generally work as documented and you go your merry way 4) When something break or doesn't work, you have the knowledge or a general idea of what to fix

Compared to proprietary systems where there is no documentation and little configuration, when things break or misbehave you're essentially screwed. Will you wait for an official fix or look online for reverse engineers? You bought a black box and you can't just open it and fix it.

I'd rather spend a day learning about my system during the installation and having it work for years, instead of buying yet another black box I can't open.

Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by deltaonefour on Monday November 08, 2021 @01:43PM (#29152653)
>I'd rather spend a day learning about my system during the installation and having it work for years, instead of buying yet another black box I can't open.

Learning linux doesn't take a day. Second off those black boxes statistically are more reliable than linux EVEN when you account for all the things you talked about.

The reason for this is simple. Microsoft has a business advantage and unfairly strong arms hardware manufacturers to make their stuff work with windows. This unfair advantage makes the windows user experience better and more reliable than GNU linux whos' developers constantly have to play catch up with hardware.

Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by _carbyau_ on Sunday November 07, 2021 @11:29PM (#29146133)
It's is sad isn't it?

In the last 20 years PC hardware has become ridiculously faster - and yet the user experience seems to have changed little.

I saw an article ages ago whereby Microsoft apparently had a dependencies approval gateway. If you made any change based on Windows you had to remove/reduce your dependencies or make a good case for not doing so.

I was hoping that would catch on.

Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by deltaonefour on Sunday November 07, 2021 @09:52PM (#29145752)
The point he's trying to make is linux on a Ryzen isn't as good as MacOS on an M1. The user experience is inferior. That is his point and his point is fact. Hope you understand now.
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by emkoemko on Monday November 08, 2021 @02:30AM (#29146814)
user experience is inferior? how so? what nonsense, i have heard countless stories on dumb things Apple forces on its users while on Linux you can just use Vulkan... Imagine if your app can't contact Apple servers they don't launch or take minutes to open...and when they do work they are recording information... why on earth do people still use closed source software. Now we have to deal with Safari crap... like we used to deal with IE5, having to have workarounds for browser standards Apple refuses to follow or implement.
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by ricardobayes on Monday November 08, 2021 @03:54AM (#29147336)
Don't waste your breath, let them be 'happy' in their little cult. I think Apple users are often mad because subconsciously they know they are taken a fool.
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by deltaonefour on Monday November 08, 2021 @01:39PM (#29152591)
It's not a cult. I use all three operating systems and I'm highly proficient using linux. My distro of choice is Manjaro and NixOS and I have a lot of experience with debian and ubuntu as well.

Each operating system has benefits and downsides. For user experience linux is definitively the worst. Definitively. The differences are so large that it's almost comical how someone on this planet can't see the difference. If you can't see this then you are the one that is part of a cult.

Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by saithir on Monday November 08, 2021 @10:59AM (#29150606)
Feels super ironic you choose to describe Apple users as a "cult" in a reply to a guy that sneaks his "Safari is the new IE5" in every response... ;)
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by josephg on Monday November 08, 2021 @06:19AM (#29148191)
> user experience is inferior? how so?

I use linux every day for work and:

- Hidpi support is spotty (its getting better but still a bit spotty)

- Smooth scrolling in applications is inconsistent at best

- The keyboard shortcuts for moving the text cursor around are inconsistent between programs

- Hardware support is much more of a crap shoot. Linux has a harder job than macos in trying to support every combination of janky hardware out there. But as a user, I don't really care. I just know that if I buy a mac, the OS will work perfectly with the hardware on offer. That isn't true on linux.

- Lots of useful software isn't available on linux. Eg, I love Monodraw, but thats macos only.

- App distribution on Linux is a mess. Apt? RPM? Snap? Flatpack? Etc etc. I have 2 copies of discord installed for some reason, and I have no idea what the difference is between them.

Etcetera..

Linux gives you the choice and freedom to spend an unlimited number of hours customizing everything. With linux I'm in complete control and I love that. On macos, things usually just work out of the box. I love that too.

No OS is perfect. There's tradeoffs with everything. If you don't understand other people's preferences, that doesn't make you right. It makes you ignorant.

Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by deltaonefour on Sunday November 07, 2021 @09:51PM (#29145747)
Linux can't even run on the M1.

He's obviously comparing a linux PC experience with an apple OSX experience. It's a completely valid comparison but you're just being mean an inappropriate.

Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by saagarjha on Monday November 08, 2021 @05:32AM (#29147915)
Linux does run on the M1. Not great, yet, but it's getting there.
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by deltaonefour on Monday November 08, 2021 @01:51PM (#29152758)
My bad. You're right. So let's compare Linux on the M1 with OSX on the M1. Which one has the better user experience?
Re:Memory leaks are crippling my M1 MacBook Pro by FDSGSG on Monday November 08, 2021 @07:41AM (#29148701)
Apparently it runs just fine a little fiddling. https://github.com/mikigal/ryzen-hackintosh