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Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by istorical on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:31PM (#29031517)
We live in a world where all of our major journalists release fun, high-five-everybody-look-at-how-shit-this-thing-is mockery pieces for every new mistake by a tech company but where are the front page Vice pieces, Washington Post articles, or NYT exposés when Johnson and Johnson sells 33,000 bottles of baby power with asbestos in them? Why wasn't Johnson and Johnson's CEO dragged in front of congress, why don't we hear constant calls to break up Johnson and Johnson? This is just one example, but it's hilarious to see the outrage, the snide articles and nose-turned-up comments, while we conveniently ignore the worst industries that are destroying our planet, the slave labor that goes into all of our physical products, the poison that often finds its way into them, or the destruction they are wreaking on nature.

As a site dominated by tech industry employees, it's time that people working in tech stop simply nodding their heads when people shift the cultural spotlight on corporate malfeasance onto tech's bully target of the year/decade, over and over and over again. We get it, social media is fucked up. Great. Now, where are the Frances Haugen's of BigChemical or BigCPG? Why aren't they household names? Why aren't we collectively outraged they aren't at congressional hearings?

This piece by Vice absolutely embodies the snide tone, the absolute derision with which we decided it's OK to paint Facebook. That's well and good, Facebook isn't great, but doing so while turning a blind eye to far greater crimes is a crime that itself ought to be castigated. A journalists mission is in part to embody the Fourth Estate - to be a watchdog. When all journalism does is stand around the classroom and pat each other on the back and point at the dunce-hat wearing stooge of the decade making obvious mistakes in an echo chamber while ignoring the subtle crimes of the popular kid, it's worthy of the same snide comments itself.

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by lapetitejort on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:42PM (#29031676)
We live in a world where two or more bad things can be talked about at the same time.

> but where are the front page Vice pieces, Washington Post articles, or NYT exposés when Johnson and Johnson sells 33,000 bottles of baby power with asbestos in them?

https://www.vice.com/en/article/433jdg/johnson-and-johnson-l...

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by tuckerman on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:55PM (#29031871)
Disclaimer: I work for an Alphabet company

I think there is a difference in the tone and and style of media coverage that large tech companies attract. I very much agree that there are a lot of terrible things happening in the world but I think it is fair to question whether or not the bias that journalist bring apportions our outrage appropriately.

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by istorical on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:47PM (#29031738)
I have no doubt these crimes do get written about, but they're third-rate beats, rarely front-page material. They don't lead to mass condemnation, they don't lead to boycotts, they don't result in congressional hearings.
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by Fordec on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:54PM (#29031866)
That article is literally by the same "beat" as the parent article.

But on your point on boycotts, yes they did[0] and on congressional hearings, also yes they did [1].

[0] https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/activists-call-bo...

[1] https://oversight.house.gov/news/press-releases/oversight-su...

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by mherdeg on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:52PM (#29031831)
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by ashwoods on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:53PM (#29031845)
I remember reading about the talc issue in Spain, and a quick search led me to congressional action on talc: https://oversight.house.gov/news/press-releases/chairman-kri... I’m afraid the bias might be elsewhere.
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by lapetitejort on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:53PM (#29031847)
They do.

https://oversight.house.gov/news/press-releases/oversight-su...

edit: three people frantically googling in unison. A beautiful sight.

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by jl6 on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:46PM (#29031721)
Increasingly, media consumers don’t know anything about chemistry, or industry, or manufacturing, or have any contacts in that world, which, to be fair, is increasingly outsourced, subcontracted, offshored, and inaccessible.

But they do spend a lot of time on Facebook, so media spends more time writing about Facebook because they know their audience will understand it (and click on it).

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by zahma on Thursday October 28, 2021 @05:07PM (#29032002)
You’re correct that there isn’t enough diversification of wrongdoing covered by the press. However, it’s not enough to just conclude the chapter on social media. This is a watershed moment that has been utterly necessary ever since Facebook was implicated in the elections and Cambridge Analytica.

The reality is most people don’t care to understand how social media is at the heart of everything, even journalism. The news sites you mentioned above are prominent sources and participants on Twitter. What does not get traction there, doesn’t make money for them, and so we are stuck in this feedback loop in which something trends and we get clickbait headlines while the world burns.

It’s actually surprising news media can step back and see who their real publishers and modern day printing presses are. Perhaps they can appreciate how tangled up they are in the feedback cycle of getting clicks because fewer and fewer people actually subscribe and passively read via social media, which nets … Meta … more money than the journal.

That is the tragedy of news media today. It’s the death of the local journal and consolidation of large media operations which are increasingly at the whim of Twitter trends and ad revenue.

So let’s keep talking about social media until we can prise control, regulate, and have healthy discussions about things other than lifestyle choices and top 10 lists.

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by grecy on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:53PM (#29031844)
> where are the front page Vice pieces, Washington Post articles, or NYT exposés when Johnson and Johnson sells 33,000 bottles of baby power with asbestos in them?

No, no, no. J&J is a good American company. Family values. Takes care of it's employees like family. Good for the economy. Ma & Pa Values.

They're nothing like free-and-footloose wild Facebook.

/s

Of course, that's the image they want everyone to believe, and old money companies work very, very hard to continue that.

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by iamstupidsimple on Thursday October 28, 2021 @05:17PM (#29032122)
This is the crux of the debate in my opinion - it's old money (finance, journalism, entertainment) vs new money (tech) that threatens to eat all their businesses alive. This is nothing more than a power struggle between the ownership classes.
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by JetSpiegel on Thursday October 28, 2021 @09:02PM (#29034060)
How is J&J threatened by Facebook?

Will this Third Life be so addictive, people will let their children shit themselves and use no baby powder?

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by iamstupidsimple on Friday October 29, 2021 @06:41AM (#29037085)
I mean technology in a general sense. But for J&J specifically, there's always the chance that a fast moving biotechnology startup will outcompete them.
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by papito on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:47PM (#29031739)
Can you blame journalists for hating big tech, when they are destroying their profession? Journalists are forced to bang out 20 clickables a day to keep up, because you've got to get those PAGE VIEWS.

The only injection of adrenaline into the veins of investigative journalism were the four years of shockingly incompetent, corrupt, and vile Trump administration.

Investigative journalism requires resources and talent, and this arena is bleeding both. And when they do dig into something, they suddenly become "main stream narratives" and "fake news".

Charlie Sykes actually had a devastating episode on the Bulwark podcast about this yesterday. Gutting of local news is leading to rampant corruption on the local level, because no one is watching. And the "small government" crowd, you know, the misguided libertarians on this very site, clamor for less oversight. Because that's what it's all about.

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by hacksnewer on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:51PM (#29031813)
They were ranting about the 4th estate...it is their job to cover stuff like this.
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by vanattab on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:51PM (#29031800)
You see the Trump years as some sort of revitalization of journalism? I have a very different take away from those years.
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by papito on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:54PM (#29031856)
Am I supposed to guess what your takeaway is?
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by vanattab on Thursday October 28, 2021 @05:20PM (#29032167)
The quality of journalism(both left and right) was degrading before trump, accelerated during trump, and is continuing to degrade.
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by cityzen on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:50PM (#29031784)
Honest question, did you read the article?
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by cbtacy on Thursday October 28, 2021 @05:29PM (#29032263)
micdrop
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by roca on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:51PM (#29031797)
What Facebook is doing to humanity is far worse than selling baby powder with possible asbestos contamination. Maybe J&J made a mistake, maybe they didn't, but it's not core to their business model like Philip Morris selling cigarettes or Facebook amplifying evil.
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by supercanuck on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:36PM (#29031581)
J&J poisoning babies doesn't make Facebook less bad.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by mysecretaccount on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:44PM (#29031693)
The term "whataboutism" is often used (like in this case) to shield against legitimate criticism. The above poster is not claiming that FB is not bad or should not be criticized - he is saying that he thinks the media treatment of contemporary moral issues is not weighted properly. Maybe you still disagree with him, but simply calling "whataboutism" muddies the water.

Here is a great episode of Citations Needed about the term "whataboutism": https://soundcloud.com/citationsneeded/episode-66-whatabouti...

Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by isoskeles on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:49PM (#29031769)
Thank you for the link. Kind of awesome there's an hour long podcast on this concept.
Re:Zuckerberg Announces Fantasy World Where Facebook Is Not ... by supercanuck on Thursday October 28, 2021 @04:57PM (#29031897)
This thread went Meta and we are no longer talking about Facebook.

You just did the same thing.