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Re:Blue Origin first human flight by AlexanderTheGr8 on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:18AM (#27894807)
"An astronaut (from the Greek "astron" (ἄστρον), meaning "star", and "nautes" (ναύτης), meaning "sailor") is a person trained, equipped, and deployed by a human spaceflight program to serve as a commander or crew member aboard a spacecraft."

They were trained (not as well trained as NASA astronauts, but still trained well enough for such a short mission)

They were equipped with whatever equipments they needed for this flight.

They were deployed by a human spaceflight program.

So by definition, shouldn't they classify as "astronauts"?

Re:Blue Origin first human flight by mdorazio on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:21AM (#27894850)
Crew members have defined roles and responsibilities, and are important to the success of a mission beyond having paid to be there. The alternative is more apt here, I think: passengers.
Re:Blue Origin first human flight by nautilius on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:35AM (#27895020)
I take it you're not a big fan of Gagarin, the first human in space, then. What was his importance beyond 'being there'?
Re:Blue Origin first human flight by KuiN on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @12:07PM (#27895537)
Vostok 1 is a tricky exception because there was no gurantee Gagarin would be conscious or even alive when he got to space. That mission had to be automated.

But he had a role other than just being a passenger. He was there to make observations on the performance of the rocket and the spacecraft, as well as himself throughout the mission. There's a clear scientific role here that the Blue Origin tourists do not have. And while the controls were locked, Gagarin had the code to unlock them and was to take over the spacecraft in the event of automation failure or another manually recoverable emergency.

Re:Blue Origin first human flight by nautilius on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @12:54PM (#27896192)
As I wrote someplace else before: his job was done by dogs and monkeys before, so it's hardly mission critical for him to even be conscious. In fact, the mission would have been considered a great success even if he had been unconscious the whole flight, as long as he survived. His presence was the key point.

Throughout Mercury, the astronauts had to fight for control elements to even be included in the spacecraft because automation was considered the safer option.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan and these steps were incredible milestones, and I certainly wouldn't have wanted to switch seats with anyone.

Here, I am sure Bezos can/would argue that "someone had to make observations on the performance of the rocket and the spacecraft, as well as himself throughout the mission". Sure, the goal here is commercial, but it's hard to argue that Gagarin's flight was made to gain pure scientific knowledge to finally answer the pressing question of how humans react to spaceflight, rather than political/technological.

Re:Blue Origin first human flight by croes on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:42AM (#27895113)
That why they called him an cosmonaut instead of astronaut. SCNR
Re:Blue Origin first human flight by AlexanderTheGr8 on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:27AM (#27894917)
You may be right.

But still for the sake of discussion, I would argue that their mission required only 1 responsibility - that you be there. Even if they orbit around the Earth, modern spacecrafts are designed in such a way that crew member input is almost unnecessary. I wonder how much crew input is needed to dock on ISS in modern crafts...

Re:Blue Origin first human flight by spicyramen on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:55AM (#27895316)
Astronaut pro tempore may apply
Re:Blue Origin first human flight by jszymborski on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:52AM (#27895275)
Surely I'm not a sailor for having taken a cruise ship. I did, however, participate in the safety demonstration, and packed my bags.

I'm definitely on-board with calling Bezos a passenger.

Re:Blue Origin first human flight by croes on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:42AM (#27895121)
To finish you wiki quote:

"Although generally reserved for professional space travelers, the terms are sometimes applied to anyone who travels into space, including scientists, politicians, journalists and tourists."

Re:Blue Origin first human flight by nemo44x on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @03:31PM (#27898153)
When I'm out rowing a boat I don't think anyone would consider me a captain. Or when I'm sitting on a ship, I don't think anyone would consider me a sailor.

When I'm on a flight I'm called a passenger, for example. They were passengers.

Re:Blue Origin first human flight by finnh on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:20AM (#27894830)
What about the "serve as commander or crew member" part?
Re:Blue Origin first human flight by l30n4da5 on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:21AM (#27894849)
are the members of the crew of Blue Origin 3 not 'crew members'?
Re:Blue Origin first human flight by Rumudiez on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:26AM (#27894911)
If I drive onto the ferry am I part of the crew? I’ve been told (trained) on what to do and I’m equipped (my car), so am I a crew member? No, I’m just a passenger following the crew’s direction.
Re:Blue Origin first human flight by yreg on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @02:10PM (#27897145)
If you are the only one aboard then you are crew.
Re:Blue Origin first human flight by rtkwe on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @02:20PM (#27897278)
If the ferry is fully automated and I don't do anything beyond parking my car safely I wouldn't say I was crew then, I'm still just a passenger until I actually do something for the operation of the vehicle/craft.
Re:Blue Origin first human flight by tshaddox on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:36AM (#27895038)
Is a passenger on a commercial flight a crew member? Would you call every passenger an “airman”?
Re:Blue Origin first human flight by lrdswrk00 on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:57AM (#27895354)
I’d ask their name and call them that.

I’m under no obligation to recognize anyone as anything but an average human without proof they’re actually skilled as they claim.

Titles are political euphemism. I want to know someone’s profile to know who I am dealing with. You’re a doctor? Of ants. Not helpful when I need someone that studied human anatomy.

None of these titles explain the training involved. The honestly gained skill set based on direct learning.

Bezos isn’t a genius; he’s a politically elevated person due to financial success. Humans will never live among the stars as the meat bags we are; far more likely we etch a simulated human consciousness into a new medium than adapt this biology. We’re just watching one guy get his jollies off at our political expense.

Titillate the masses to keep them politically disorganized. Humans used to wage holy wars, invade other nations to do that. Now it’s engineering and economic spectacle.

What a trivial and boring people I live among. Collectively setting themselves aside to ogle this stuff.

Re:Blue Origin first human flight by JshWright on Tuesday July 20, 2021 @11:23AM (#27894875)
Is the passenger sitting in 23E on a flight from Newark to LA a "crew member"?