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Re:India bans MasterCard from adding new customers by gpm on Wednesday July 14, 2021 @11:07AM (#27833897)
All data is capable of being decrypted somewhere. Usually where you are storing it. Otherwise you can't do anything with it.

Storing data encryped in north korea, with the capability to fetch and decrypt that data in Sweden, is approximately equivalent to storing the unencrypted data in Sweden (as far as hackers, law enforcement, etc. are concerned), except you've now added the additional risk that north korea only needs to exfiltrate one encryption key to gain access to all your data.

More reasonably, if you're storing the data in north korea, that's also where you have the compute, and therefore the decryption keys, and therefore someone in north korea who knows what they are doing can quitely steal the decryption keys, make a copy of your data, and view all the data unencrypted.

Encryption is only foolproof(ish) when you are sending data between two trusted endpoints. That's not the case for the cloud, the place you are storing the data is also almost always one of the "trusted" endpoints. Encrypting the data at rest has some minor benefits (being a hurdle to accessing the data, meaning that theft of a single hard disk doesn't get data) but doesn't provide any form of unbreakable security.

Re:India bans MasterCard from adding new customers by kspacewalk2 on Wednesday July 14, 2021 @12:09PM (#27834684)
Usually where you're processing it, not where you're storing it. That's when you need to do something with it.

Encrypting the data at rest has the major benefit of making its physical location completely irrelevant. Transmitting the data while encrypted has the major benefit of making the physical location of all the nodes through which it passes completely irrelevant. Hence the only thing that matters is the geographic location of where the data is processed, because that is where you decrypt it. All privacy laws should be written with that understanding, but they are not. They are written by people who are ignorant of this simple logic, because they don't understand how Internet works, how encryption works, how routing traffic works and how little it has to do with borders of countries, etc etc.

Healthcare privacy laws in my country, for example, have this exactly 100% backwards. They force me to store data in my country, but say nothing about where it is processed. And of course there's no hard requirement to encrypt data at rest. It's hard to imagine how you can get this kind of law more wrong.

Re:India bans MasterCard from adding new customers by josefx on Wednesday July 14, 2021 @01:40PM (#27835832)
Physical location and encryption should be treated as two independent protection requirements, both of which have to be met. Just because something is encrypted doesn't mean it is protected, we already have a few encryption schemes that are no longer considered secure and even if you cannot crack a scheme right now there is always the weak link[1] in the chain.

[1]https://xkcd.com/538/

Re:India bans MasterCard from adding new customers by kspacewalk2 on Wednesday July 14, 2021 @03:35PM (#27837416)
If you used an encryption scheme that is no longer considered secure, the correct response is not to rely on the fact that the server room is under lock and key and your country has, like, really nice laws and stuff. It's to change the encryption scheme.

The XKCD cartoon is another way of stating (part of) my point - it doesn't matter where the stuff is stored (provided you encrypt it properly), what matters is the point at which it can be accessed. A dead owner's encrypted iPhone in the FBI forensics lab is more secure from intrusion by the FBI than an unencrypted hard drive I locked in my basement. Even if I use, like, 10 locks, and they don't (yet) know it's there.

Re:India bans MasterCard from adding new customers by ajdude on Wednesday July 14, 2021 @03:51PM (#27837601)
I think the point the parent comment was trying to make was, consider if you are storing data in North Korea; it’s 2010 and your encryption scheme is considered secure.

At some point, North Korea has copied the encrypted data for later data mining.

In 2021 that encryption scheme for some reason is no longer considered secure. Even if you stepped using it in 2014, the data from the time you used it up until you stopped may be compromised.

Re:India bans MasterCard from adding new customers by TheCoelacanth on Wednesday July 14, 2021 @09:51PM (#27840671)
Only compared to an unencrypted hard drive locked in an American basement.

An unencrypted hard drive stored in a locked Chinese basement is probably quite a bit more secure from FBI intrusion than the encrypted iPhone that they physically possess.

Physical access still matters a lot.

Re:India bans MasterCard from adding new customers by dec0dedab0de on Wednesday July 14, 2021 @02:42PM (#27836730)
Storing data encryped in north korea, with the capability to fetch and decrypt that data in Sweden, is approximately equivalent to storing the unencrypted data in Sweden

Not if there is rate limiting, or other means of preventing the entire set of data being dumped. That is to say, storing it encrypted makes it harder to get the full set of data. Though, I guess in practice the client application would likely be able to request all of the data from storage.

Re:India bans MasterCard from adding new customers by sameerds on Wednesday July 14, 2021 @11:42PM (#27841174)
And the whole point of cornering data at rest is that your client can "no longer access it". It's not about the authorities being able to decrypt that data. It's about hurting your business by making it difficult to continue operations.
Re:India bans MasterCard from adding new customers by dannyw on Wednesday July 14, 2021 @11:35AM (#27834276)
No, I can store encrypted data in North Korea without storing any decryption keys there.

I run a Filecoin node and I store the data of approximately 200 clients in my homelab. I don't know who they are, or what they store, because it's all end to end encrypted.

And no -- my clients don't trust me, it's crypto, it's trustless :)