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Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by 238475235243 on Friday June 25, 2021 @05:00PM (#27636213)
The only thing they left out was swamp gas as a possible explanation (RIP Hynek).

Seems like another whitewash, "it can't possibly be happening" report.

If you spend some serious effort on this and stay away from the crazies you'll come to the opposite conclusion of this report. A good starting point is Vallee's books.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by colechristensen on Friday June 25, 2021 @05:09PM (#27636311)
I don't know about Vallee, but after being briefly in the defense industry, reading much, and having some experience with aerospace everything seems to fit very well into one of three categories

1) known US aircraft activity either simply misinterpreted or kept secret from the public or even most of the military apparatus, sometimes strongly denied either as a way to disseminate vague information to adversaries or misinformation

2) foreign or personal aircraft either known or unknown to the US.

3) rare weather phenomena, hallucinations, optical phenomena, or other miscellaneous things which might be rare but with mundane explanations

The thing to notice is cameras have become much more prevalent and much higher resolution, but "UFOs" in pictures haven't. The only things that aren't obviously something understandable are still fuzzy dots on screens despite screens and cameras getting enormously better.

Just look at this https://media.gvwire.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/28154540... and tell me that if you saw that you wouldn't think it was a spaceship. It was kept super secret for a quite a long time and surely was the source of plenty of UFO reports.

I'm not convinced or even particularly suspicious that anything that "isn't what it seems" is anything more than mundane.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by 238475235243 on Friday June 25, 2021 @05:15PM (#27636365)
Where to begin?

1) This isn't a recent phenomena. People have been seeing discs in the sky for literally thousands of years.

2) Aircraft can't make 90 degree turns or descend from 80,000 feet to the deck approximately instantly.

3) Groups of extremely highly trained military pilots have seen them, and the video and IR data has been released from these encounters. You can't make 4 people in 2 aircraft hallucinate at the same time, and fool all the instrumentation on them (radar, IR...) and also fool the battlespace radars on the cruisers directing them. And if you could, that too would be kind of interesting to look at whatever that is.

You're repeating old points you don't understand because as you acknowledge, you don't know the subject. Please start with Vallee.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by krferriter on Friday June 25, 2021 @05:55PM (#27636740)
> 1) This isn't a recent phenomena. People have been seeing discs in the sky for literally thousands of years.

People have reported talking to ghosts and angels for thousands of years too. People's senses and memory is fallible and can lead to misinterpretations and misunderstanding.

> 2) Aircraft can't make 90 degree turns or descend from 80,000 feet to the deck approximately instantly.

You are assuming that their reports that the objects actually made these movements are indeed correct perceptions of the movements seen.

> 3) Groups of extremely highly trained military pilots have seen them, and the video and IR data has been released from these encounters. You can't make 4 people in 2 aircraft hallucinate at the same time, and fool all the instrumentation on them (radar, IR...) and also fool the battlespace radars on the cruisers directing them. And if you could, that too would be kind of interesting to look at whatever that is.

A lot of conflation going on here. The Nimitz incident did involve 4(?) people, but not at the same time. The radar technician (radar data has not been released) did report seeing multiple objects on the radar, but not much else about them such as the rapid, physics-defying movements reported by the Fravor the pilot who reportedly saw an object with his own eyes. The IR video captured by another pilot also does have reasonable explanations (even including the on-screen display sensor readings) that counteract the claims that the object was moving as fast as they thought it was at the time, or as the video might make it seem.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by 238475235243 on Friday June 25, 2021 @06:22PM (#27636996)
> but not at the same time.

The initial two F-18's had two people each.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by krferriter on Friday June 25, 2021 @07:04PM (#27637321)
And they all saw the same object from the same perspective which could have resulted in similar visual effects leading them to misjudge how far away the object was. They reported that it was very far away but the sensor readings in the thermal video and other alternate theories about what the object was suggest that it wasn't as far away as they thought. Which if true would explain why they thought it was moving faster than they thought.

I was referring to the disjoin between the radar technician, the fighter team with Fravor, and the later fighter plane that actually captured the infrared video.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by 238475235243 on Friday June 25, 2021 @08:27PM (#27637885)
> And they all saw the same object from the same perspective

This just isn't true if you listen to their interviews. I'm going to assume you're just the disinformation guy now.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by krferriter on Saturday June 26, 2021 @12:29AM (#27639123)
I mean that they saw it from in the air at the same distance, and all most likely mistakenly thought the object was farther away from them than it actually was. Especially since they have all been in communication and crosstalk plants seeds in other people's heads. If one pilot says "hey that object looks like it's 10 miles away" then all the other people will by default have that thought, even if it is actually only 5 miles away. This is true especially when in the air because it is extremely difficult to judge distances and sizes.

FAA doc on visual perception in the air:

https://www.faa.gov/pilots/safety/pilotsafetybrochures/media...

Failures in visual perception for pilots and people in boats are widely known shortcomings of human eyes. We just aren't evolved to see things at that scale accurately.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by King-Aaron on Friday June 25, 2021 @06:32PM (#27637071)
> The thing to notice is cameras have become much more prevalent and much higher resolution, but "UFOs" in pictures haven't.

Get out your phone, and take a picture of your hand. Its very close, and you'll get a great photo.

Now, go outside at night, look at the beacon on top of a crane in the distance, or a plane landing a few kilometres away. Try to take a photo of it with your phone camera.

We have great cameras, sure, but not everyone is carrying a 300mm lens in their pocket

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by marc_io on Friday June 25, 2021 @05:59PM (#27636784)
“The thing to notice is cameras have become much more prevalent and much higher resolution, but "UFOs" in pictures haven't.”

Just two examples of high resolution UAP videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBQ1Ftj4hPE&ab_channel=OrdoN...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVmGhxYrkug&t=0s&ab_channel=...

The problem is not resolution per se, but the fact that is quite easy nowadays to manipulate images and videos (I'm not saying these videos are fake, BTW).

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by user-the-name on Friday June 25, 2021 @08:00PM (#27637710)
They're not fake, they're just two videos of an insect flying past a drone.
Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by skinkestek on Saturday June 26, 2021 @09:22AM (#27641588)
The second, not unlikely at all.

The first doesn't look like an insect to me even after being primed by your comment prior to watching it.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by marc_io on Saturday June 26, 2021 @11:48AM (#27642867)
There's a pretty meticulous review of the second video out there — the raw vídeo was available online for some time — that proves it's neither bug nor CGI.

I haven't found any analysis of the first one though, it could be CGI but it doesn't seem to be an actual bug.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by user-the-name on Saturday June 26, 2021 @12:58PM (#27643564)
It's a bug, dude, come on. It's pretty obvious.
Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by marc_io on Sunday June 27, 2021 @01:31AM (#27648866)
It could be CGI, but an actual bug? Not at all if you analyse the vídeo closely.

The “bug” appears several miles away, following the mountains, and crosses the camera in just a second. That's not a real real bug.

But lets try again: watch all of the following:

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4tDSbqa8tyOLSOhF82YkiP7u...

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by user-the-name on Sunday June 27, 2021 @03:37PM (#27654561)
You do most definitely not have a single piece of data that tells you that it appears "several miles away". It does not. It appears a few tens of meters away, at the very most.
Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by marc_io on Monday June 28, 2021 @03:59PM (#27667082)
It does. This data is in the video itself. Just look into the trajectory of the “object” in the video, or watch some of the analysis that were done about it.
Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by user-the-name on Saturday June 26, 2021 @12:59PM (#27643573)
Meeting an insect while flying at speed and altitude isn't going to look like an insect, it's just going to look like a blur zooming past suddenly.
Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by skinkestek on Saturday June 26, 2021 @05:22PM (#27646008)
Doesn't seem like the first camera is moving much, or does it and I don't notice?
Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by user-the-name on Saturday June 26, 2021 @08:40PM (#27647405)
Look at 0:21. If you pick a point at the bottom of the screen, you can see how fast the drone is moving relative to the buildings. It's going quite fast.
Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by skinkestek on Sunday June 27, 2021 @05:27AM (#27650008)
I looked at that and then continued watching:

At the point where the object passes the camera platform is moving right to left while the approaching object is moving far to near and right-to-left.

Note: I'm not saying it is or isn't a natural phenomena or is or isn't a hoax, only that I think the first one probably isn't an insect.

Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by user-the-name on Sunday June 27, 2021 @03:38PM (#27654569)
The bug is flying in one direction, the drone in another.
Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by no-dr-onboard on Friday June 25, 2021 @05:15PM (#27636374)
For those that can't be bothered, the photo linked above is a Lockheed Martin F-117, an early-era stealth fighter jet.
Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by jimhefferon on Friday June 25, 2021 @05:35PM (#27636568)
Not a person who has looked much into this stuff, but the videos you see online lately sure seemed impressive. FWIW, I felt educated by videos by Mick West, who is a debunker. Https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwa-yYCEGEc&t=1316s is one that a technical person such as an HN reader might like.
Re:Preliminary Assessment: Unidentified Aerial Phenomena by King-Aaron on Friday June 25, 2021 @08:58PM (#27638048)
I find it hard to listen to Mick West, because he's built a brand around debunking things - I like to remain sceptical around most things however when you have a vested interest in being 'anti' towards a topic it's as biased as being a 'believer' in something.