News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers by NaturalPhallacy on Monday June 14, 2021 @03:07PM (#27506821)
I'm currently a registered Pacific Green, lean left, and on the political compass I'm basically smack dab on top of Bernie Sanders (whom I voted for and donated to in the 2016 primaries). And have never voted Republican. So his observation is about my own "side" more or less.

But I'm totally unsurprised to see this downvoted here only 18 minutes in.

Here's a short article on the paper: https://ricochet.com/76902/archives/conservatives-understand...

The paper itself: https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2027266

Here's his TED talk on it: https://www.ted.com/talks/jonathan_haidt_the_moral_roots_of_...

What's funny is if you bring this up (even with sources) to conservatives. They're unsurprisingly unsurprised. But if you bring it up to liberals they often get furious because it goes against their beliefs that they're the more intelligent, more educated "side". Nevermind that believing in only two possible sides is six times dumber than astrology... something "both sides" are about equally guilty of. If nothing else I strongly encourage everyone to watch his TED talk. It's super informative, well delivered, and has a solid message of unity tbh.

Re:Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers by mariodiana on Monday June 14, 2021 @03:26PM (#27507063)
Thank you.

I have a friend I haven't seen since high school, though I'm connected with him on Facebook. He will outright tell you himself that he's a communist—familiar with the writings of Marx, etc. We could not be more diametrically opposed. However, he's as clear-eyed as you seem to be.

I suspect that most people simply aren't all that intellectually curious. I don't remember if Haidt explicitly mentioned this, but I think somewhere either he or someone commenting on his study asserted that it is much easier to pick up the party line of liberals through osmosis, since those in education, the media, and so forth tend to be liberal. So, even conservatives are more readily exposed to the liberal take on things. Liberals on the other hand are not.

But the point I'm making by mentioning my friend and thanking you is that I suspect that people who are intellectually curious are more or less inoculated against mischaracterizing the side they disagree with, since they don't learn almost exclusively through osmosis.

I appreciate your contribution to this thread.

[dead]
Re:Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers by NaturalPhallacy on Monday June 14, 2021 @04:02PM (#27507547)
I recommend watching his TED talk. It goes into more detail, and expounds on the abstract underpinnings of both liberal and conservative morals. They're very different. The axes apply even outside America, consistently.
Re:Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers by mariodiana on Monday June 14, 2021 @04:35PM (#27507958)
I'm a fan of Haidt and think his moral "tastebuds" (I think he makes that analogy somewhere) is an interesting model. I largely buy into it, but I found a really perceptive take in this short blog post that came out a few years back that's a bit more skeptical. https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2017/05/26/trump-as-...
Re:Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers by dragonwriter on Monday June 14, 2021 @04:52PM (#27508158)
I think this piece, referenced in one of the comments to the one you reference, is particularly on point:

https://crookedtimber.org/2017/01/22/protestandpolarization/

Re:Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers by mariodiana on Tuesday June 15, 2021 @12:06PM (#27517448)
Thank you for that. I used to read Crooked Timber pretty regularly, years ago. In fact, I had one of the sometime contributors for a semester as a philosophy professor (back in the last century).

I agree Haidt's model is flawed, especially on the idea of sacredness being something liberals aren't concerned with. I think he's onto something, but he's painted with too broad a brush.

Lately, I've been reading a lot on the subject of religion: specifically, from an anthropological or sociological perspective. I'm interested in the idea of ersatz religions—filling the void left by modernity's secularism. My suspicion is that the great bulk of people cannot do without the things that religion affords; and so if they aren't "religious" in the traditional sense, they unwittingly find some substitute that does everything but revere Christ, YHWH, Allah, etc.

Behavior that fits that model I see again and again, on what we think of as the political left.