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Re:Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production by threeseed on Tuesday May 11, 2021 @06:34PM (#27124455)
The idea that China has a 100% chance of winning is laughable and plain wrong.

There are so many dynamics involved e.g. Japan needing to defend the Senkaku Islands, India, UK and EU member states being involved and the fact that you an increasingly united front within APAC.

Also China's military is a lot of smoke and mirrors. They simply can't match the F-22 and F-35 in the air or the Ford class aircraft carriers in the sea. And US is looking to build a missile defence system on Guam to prevent long range attacks.

There are simply too many factors in play to give any percentage of winning.

Re:Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production by WillPostForFood on Tuesday May 11, 2021 @06:43PM (#27124532)
The US hasn't even committed to defending Taiwan. I doubt the US would militarily intervene. The risk of escalation is too high. If China is committed to taking it, they will get it. The response would be economic, and I'm not confident enough of the world cares, or isn't already beholden to China for it to matter.

>Ford class aircraft carriers

Isn't there only one Ford class carrier? And it is still not fully ready, and it is in the Atlantic, so at this point is not ready to play a part in any South China Sea conflict.

Re:Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production by threeseed on Tuesday May 11, 2021 @06:57PM (#27124672)
At this point there is very little economic sanctions US could impose on China that Trump didn't already either try or talk about. And anything with teeth will never work whilst US companies build everything in China. So for me a short military dispute is more likely.

No one is expecting war this year. There will be 3 Ford Class carriers by 2030 and 5 by 2040. As well as the Nimitz class which are still better than what China has today.

Re:Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production by RhodoGSA on Tuesday May 11, 2021 @08:30PM (#27125300)
China has too much USD denominated debt to last against a protracted trade war.
Re:Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production by chii on Wednesday May 12, 2021 @12:01AM (#27126445)
That's not really true - china uses the USD they own to peg the RMB to enhance their export.

In times of war, this USD debt is going to be a liability for china, since the US can just refuse to repay it (and after all, what else is china going to do about? Declare war again?).

Re:Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production by RhodoGSA on Wednesday May 12, 2021 @02:46PM (#27133737)
https://www.lynalden.com/global-dollar-short-squeeze/

Kind of explains the problems with China having too much USD debt. Even without times of war.

Re:Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production by AnthonyMouse on Tuesday May 11, 2021 @07:56PM (#27125090)
> At this point there is very little economic sanctions US could impose on China that Trump didn't already either try or talk about. And anything with teeth will never work whilst US companies build everything in China.

This is a contradiction. It leaves open the possibility of sanctions sufficient to induce US companies to stop building everything in China.

In the long term the cost of this is negligible or produces a net benefit. Maybe some things cost more if it would have been cheaper to make them in China, but that isn't necessarily true outside of China's cross-subsidies which you're then still paying for, and even if they do you get the countervailing economic benefit of repatriating some of the production. (It's also plausible that sanctions on China would move production to places like Mexico and Brazil which are still cheaper than the US, but then you're back to no significant long-term cost increase and a benefit from diversifying production.)

The main cost is in the short term, because things would cost more. But they would cost more by the amount of the tariffs. Which go to the government, which it can then give back to the domestic population in various ways. Which could produce a domestic benefit, if China ends up paying any of the tariffs. If there is a $1 import tariff which pays for a $1 tax reduction for the middle class, but the tariff is paid $0.75 by the domestic buyer and $0.25 by the foreign manufacturer, you just transferred $0.25 to the domestic population.

The only way you even get a short-term domestic cost is if manufacturing actually does start moving out of China. Because then you have a $1 tariff which causes people to be willing to pay $0.25 more for a product made in Ohio or Mexico. Which costs you the $0.25 and then you don't get the $1 to offset domestic taxes. But it costs China $5, i.e. the full value of the sale and not just the amount of the tariff or the marginal cost of manufacturing it elsewhere. It costs them more than it costs the US. Which gives the US more negotiating leverage to get whatever concessions they want.

Re:Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production by simonblack on Tuesday May 11, 2021 @08:14PM (#27125212)
Don't make the same mistake of under-estimating China in 2021, that the US made of underestimating Japan in 1941.

To see the mind-set of the US/Europeans in the 1940s, take the time to watch the miniseries "The Singapore Grip". The British in particular were very dismissive of the Japanese. They sent a whole two(!) battleships off to destroy the Japanese invasion fleet. The Japanese polished them off in about an hour and a half. [I see that moment as the point when the whole British Empire died. But it took the British another 15 years to recognise that death.]

Re:Tech giants join call for funding U.S. chip production by hadlock on Wednesday May 12, 2021 @07:07AM (#27128906)
China has been testing their recently-deployed DF-21 and DF-26 "aircraft-carrier killer" missiles. They're basically non-nuclear ICBMs that come straight down, from above, a battleship, dead center, at Mach 2+. It's basically a 4,000 mile hole punch for warships. The only reason nobody's really talking about them yet is because they're ambiguously running afoul of the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty, which we're no longer part of. Also, they haven't actually been used in combat. But presumably they have enough to sink our navy twice over, and are shipped in a standard 40' shipping container.

Getting in a naval battle with China may likely someday become "getting in a land war with Russia".

> https://www.scmp.com/news/china/military/article/3098972/chi...