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Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by nullserver on Thursday March 04, 2021 @07:33PM (#26350692)
I learned the hard way that using a persons name instead of desired pronoun is a major offense.
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by temp667 on Thursday March 04, 2021 @07:51PM (#26350876)
It is, I do this routinely because I'm constantly meeting people and don't have desired pronounces in front of me.
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by petrocrat on Thursday March 04, 2021 @08:46PM (#26351397)
I don't understand... How is referring to someone by their name offensive?
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by benjohnson on Thursday March 04, 2021 @09:21PM (#26351699)
The theory of it being 'bad' is that it's a work around having to use a pronouns that you may object to.
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by mjevans on Thursday March 04, 2021 @11:14PM (#26352604)
I object to using pronouns, and many people dislike singular they.

I refuse to allow a DDoS on my memory space to recall everyone's preferred form of being addressed; I have a hard enough time remembering names.

Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by nitrogen on Friday March 05, 2021 @12:51AM (#26353287)
It's kind of like we're witnessing the emergence of a new style/honorifics system: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Style_(form_of_address)
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by nullserver on Friday March 05, 2021 @02:43AM (#26353975)
Massive fines in New York if you refuse.
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by throwaway98797 on Thursday March 04, 2021 @11:38PM (#26352772)
I’ve also started to avoid greetings. Just launch into whatever topic. More efficient.
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by nullserver on Thursday March 04, 2021 @11:50PM (#26352868)
Tried this. It gets obvious quick.

Sensitive people are on the lookout for being disrespected

Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by Spivak on Thursday March 04, 2021 @10:04PM (#26352054)
It’s not. The parent is leaving out basically all the context so that this kind of thing sounds inherently unreasonable.

Bailey: I’m avoiding using someone’s preferred pronouns because I don’t respect their gender identity.

Motte: “What so using someone’s name is offensive now?”

From what they did say I think it’s reasonably safe to assume that the person they we’re talking about was non-binary, agender, and went by they/them but it really doesn’t matter.

A very common experience that trans people face is people unnaturally avoiding the use of their pronouns and either structuring sentences awkwardly or by using their name all the time. The literal act of using someone’s name isn’t offensive but when it’s done because you’re avoiding using their pronouns then it’s rude. And it’s super obvious when people do it which makes everyone feel uncomfortable.

Now because trans people deal with this all the time it’s possible that they were more sensitive to it than normal and overreacted but given the parent took offense to being called out and they used dismissive scare quotes to describe the person’s gender identity rather than it being a two second “oh my bad” thing I think suggests not.

Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by temp667 on Saturday March 06, 2021 @07:16PM (#26371820)
In my case - the downside to misgendering someone is extremely high. If my work day was to skip work and go hiking, or go into work and misgender someone, the latter has much higher downside consequences in some areas.

The other issue, I've had preferred pronouns change. I'm not sure if that has settled down, but there was a lot of new language / wording constantly churning. There was a him that was a her, but then I found out they preferred they instead of her - so I'd been mis-pronouning them even though I wasn't misgendering them.

Given the amount of risk involved in getting this stuff wrong, it really is safer just to use names.

If you use names, you need to use them for everyone. This can get complicated for some folks because names like Ted, Bob, Sue, Joe etc may be more familiar from a pronunciation standpoint for a white person for example, but then that person avoids pronouncing Khamala or Nkosazana because they are uneasy with how to pronounce the name. That becomes obvious pretty quickly.

Managers also have had some awkward situations correcting minority employees use of terms if the manager is of a different background, ie, someone saying latino community (who is themselves latino), and manager has to correct them that it is latinx not latino.

Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by Kerrick on Thursday March 04, 2021 @10:49PM (#26352399)
Here's an example of a fairly natural bit of text referring to somebody who uses he/him:

> Kerrick's wife called; he isn't going to make it today because he's sick. We're with him in spirit.

Here's an example of unnaturally replacing all pronouns with somebody's name, which reads quite awkwardly:

> Kerrick's wife called; Kerrick isn't going to make it today because Kerrick is sick. We're with Kerrick in spirit.

Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by nullserver on Thursday March 04, 2021 @11:34PM (#26352738)
It is awkward, no question.

But I’m not the one trying to redefine reality.

Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by Spivak on Friday March 05, 2021 @12:56AM (#26353315)
I think you’re thinking about this too mechanically. Context and intent matter here. It’s not at all about the literal act.

Using someone’s name instead of their pronouns isn’t offensive and vice versa. The thing that’s invalidating [1] is when someone goes out of their way to not use your preferred name or pronouns when that someone would have called you by your name or used your pronouns if you were cis. That kind of thing is noticed by people who are trans and feels supper shitty.

So yeah anyone who tries to make a rule saying “you must always use pronouns after using their name in a sentence” or something like that is being ridiculous and also missing the point.

[1] I don’t think offended really makes sense in this situation because that’s not really the emotion at play.

Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by eplanit on Thursday March 04, 2021 @07:53PM (#26350894)
Why is it (honest question)? And what happened?
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by nullserver on Thursday March 04, 2021 @11:12PM (#26352596)
Because immediately afterwards public shaming follows. Managers pull you aside and give threatening talks.
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by marshmallow_12 on Thursday March 04, 2021 @09:56PM (#26351981)
probably a Judge(?)
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by icameron on Thursday March 04, 2021 @07:55PM (#26350919)
It is? Could you elaborate? I don’t know want to learn anything the hard way
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by nullserver on Thursday March 04, 2021 @08:09PM (#26351059)
Well I got a public lecture when I referred to some that had “no” gender by their name. Went downhill after that.
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by petrocrat on Thursday March 04, 2021 @08:48PM (#26351416)
Since it is not obvious why calling someone by their name would be offensive, did they explain why using their name was offensive?
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by nullserver on Thursday March 04, 2021 @11:13PM (#26352597)
Because I was not using a pronoun.
Re:Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay by bitdizzy on Thursday March 04, 2021 @11:50PM (#26352864)
So you singled out this person by using a different speech pattern than you would normally use so that you wouldn't have to accommodate a request to use a different set of pronouns in your normal speech while referring to that person?