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Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by dkonofalski on Wednesday February 17, 2021 @12:57PM (#26169340)
1. Sales != market share but that's not relevant. Even a >50% share isn't a monopoly if there are multiple other competitors in the remaining 50%. And I don't think anyone is misrepresenting Apple's position. The word "Monopoly" has a meaning. Apple does not fit that meaning.

2. You can't give your customers an app without paying Apple if your customers are demanding it work for Apple products. That doesn't mean you can't compete. You can still only sell to Android users and other phone users but you have to do so with the understanding of what that means. You're still competing. That's like saying you can't compete with Windows when you only release your app for Linux. That's your choice. You're still competing against Windows.

Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by simion314 on Wednesday February 17, 2021 @01:12PM (#26169542)
I know Apple is very dear for many people but let's think different , say 49% of the radios in people homes and cars are made by Huawei and if I want my radio station to work on this radios I need to pay Huawei 30% of my profits and I can only have content approved by Huawei just in case is not respecting the correct values. It is ridiculous right to have a radio or TV device put artificial limits,

Your second point is again invalid, say Apple is blocking my website because I said that they are greedy, this is fine in your opinion because I can still show my site to PC and Android users and you can't even see yet the abuse that is happening, Apple should not decide that they don't like the politics on an app or book and not allow the user the freedom to install it, they can block it from the store sure but the user should have the freedom to use his brain and install what he wants, The same for say a group of developers or musicians that want to compete with Apple products , like the Apple Store, or Apple Music or whatever games they have, it is actually ilegal for Apple to abuse their market share in smartphones to give it's own products an advantage. (yeah actually the law does not say you must have 50% +1 market share)

Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by dkonofalski on Wednesday February 17, 2021 @01:40PM (#26169878)
Both of your analogies are flawed.

1. Huawei, in your example, didn't create the radio station platform. We're not talking about publicly accessible platforms, we're talking about a app platform that Apple created, cultivated, and maintains 100%.

2. Again, this analogy has the same issue. Apple doesn't own the entire internet. If Apple started blocking websites, that would be wrong because those websites existed and continue to exist without Apple. The App Store does not have that same providence and was 100% created by Apple.

No one ever said that you have to have 50% + 1 market share so I don't know where you're getting that from. Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, Amazon, Google... all these companies own the marketplaces for their devices. This is not illegal and there is precedent protecting it.

Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by simion314 on Wednesday February 17, 2021 @03:06PM (#26170989)
No, you are trying to make it appear that it is physically impossible to run an application on Apple devices without using the store, This is FALSE, see the laptops , you can run applications without using the Apple store or their dev tools. So users should be allowed same fucking freedom on the phones as on the laptops, the only excuses I see are "most iOS users are retards and they will get scammed" or "Apple should have the right to be assholes and abuse their customers if the market allows it and don't dare try to question Apple, even when they make mistakes they are perfect"
Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by dkonofalski on Thursday February 18, 2021 @11:12AM (#26181608)
I literally never said that so you're lying and/or arguing a straw man here.

The difference is that laptops have always been able to run that stuff. iOS was setup from the beginning to only allow apps from the App Store.

If users want the freedom to install whatever they want on their devices, they can go with Android.

Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by simion314 on Thursday February 18, 2021 @12:45PM (#26183001)
>If users want the freedom to install whatever they want on their devices, they can go with Android.

Why should be this true? Why a law that forbids radio and TV makers to lock their device is good for society but a similar law for phones is less good? What is the benefit? The only benefit is more money for Apple so maybe you love Apple more then people but it makes no sense, sorry.

Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by dkonofalski on Thursday February 18, 2021 @02:18PM (#26184232)
Again, radio and TV are public utilities. The public paid to create that infrastructure and the technology and resources necessary to support it. It should have a law that forbids people from any kind of limitation since citizens paid for all of that.

Apple is a private company whose shareholders decide what's best based on the fact that they created the infrastructure and technology of their platform and they are the ones spending money and resources to ensure its quality and reliability.

If you want to pass laws to solve this problem, create a National App Store platform and then require companies to allow access to it. Forcing Apple to change their own App Store, though, is wrong. How much I love Apple or how much I love people has nothing to do with it.

And not to put to fine a point on it but you can do whatever you want with your iPhone after you've bought it. You can take it apart, swap out components, repair it yourself, jailbreak it, or whatever you want and Apple can't do anything about it (and won't). You're talking about forcing a company to change its own operations for their platform just because you don't like it or agree with the restrictions they've chosen to place on it. I would be really curious to see if you'd be willing to have a private company force you to do something you don't want to do with your own property or self.

Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by _jal on Wednesday February 17, 2021 @01:39PM (#26169869)
> It is ridiculous right to have a radio or TV device put artificial limits,

I take it you then also demand that Sirius and Comcast broadcast anyone who brings them any old content, then? Everything should public access?

For that matter, terrestrial radio stations also must broadcast the End is Nigh clapboard kooks, too, right?

Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by simion314 on Wednesday February 17, 2021 @02:37PM (#26170540)
This is frankly a stupid comparison, I did not ask that Apple put my game, music or books in their store and promote it. I ask that the device can be used without limitations. There were laws that forbid radio devices to be "locked" and there were also laws for phones to also not allow locking them to a specific carrier (the exception was that if you were getting the phone with a discount with a 2 year contract after the 2 years you had the right to unlock your phone for free).

I would appreciate if you try a bit more to make the distinction between Apple Store market and just he hardware(the laptop or phone).

Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by dkonofalski on Thursday February 18, 2021 @02:25PM (#26184291)
You're the one muddying the waters, here. You keep comparing device restrictions between iPhones and radios when they're completely different. One accesses a public good and the other a private platform.
Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by simion314 on Friday February 19, 2021 @01:52AM (#26190445)
Let me give you a different examples, bank ATM machines, guess what it is a private object, connected to a private bank, on private property and still that laws (in EU) forced this banks to make the ATMs interoperable and to stop the giant extra taxes when you used a card from bank A on an ATM from bank B.

So probably in your view this is evil, the people forced a private entity to not be a jerk and apply a big tax. Evil or not this is possible, a law can be made to limit the Google/Apple tax and the same law can be made to force side loading or block loot-boxes.

Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by stale2002 on Wednesday February 17, 2021 @01:01PM (#26169388)
A literal monopoly is not required for something to be illegally anti competitive.

All that has to happen is that a company has significant market power.

And courts have held that 50% of a given geographic area can fall under anti trust laws.

Re:Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint by dkonofalski on Wednesday February 17, 2021 @01:13PM (#26169562)
That's completely fine. The current situation already has precedent in courts considering that Sony, Microsoft, Google, Apple, Amazon, and many others have exclusive control of their App Stores. Claiming Apple is anti-competitive because of its platform would upend all of these platforms.