News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Uber discovered they’d been defrauded out of 2/3 of their... by TeMPOraL on Sunday January 03, 2021 @04:53PM (#25625598)
How do you determine a reputable agency though?

I worked next desk to people running a small ad agency. Because we shared office (and I found them an intern), I got a very good look at how they're working. What I've seen can be summarized as: people who have zero clue or interest in statistics writing "reports", with "graphs" they don't even understand beyond "pointing up = good", proving positive ROI to customers - who also have zero clue or interest in understanding the numbers in the report, and not enough visibility into the whole funnel to independently check attribution. Both the agency and the clients were engaging in a shared and completely unjustified fiction of positive advertising return - and as long as both sides were happy, the money kept flowing.

I've been long since suspecting a lot of advertising on-line looks like that. Every now and then, I see evidence in favor. Like that good ol' Optimizely debacle, where it turned out Optimizely was structurally optimized to help people make invalid A/B tests, that erred on the side of concluding the interventions were working[0]. And sure, big brands with some superstar ad teams probably do this right. But I think there's enough slack in most businesses that advertising spend can get quite far detached from actual ROI without anyone noticing (and with plenty of people happily riding the gravy train).

--

[0] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10872359

Re:Uber discovered they’d been defrauded out of 2/3 of their... by johnrgrace on Sunday January 03, 2021 @06:24PM (#25626283)
Have you ever engaged with the large advertizing holding companies? They have teams of HIGHLY acomplished data scientists, boutique vendors for specific niches etc. Even if you don't pay for it there will be some people skilled at statistics looking at reports. If you pay for it, there will be data scientists doing analysis.

The large ad firms deliver a very good product but it usually isn't cheap.

Re:Uber discovered they’d been defrauded out of 2/3 of their... by TeMPOraL on Sunday January 03, 2021 @06:33PM (#25626332)
I haven't, and I don't doubt that's true (at least in many cases; I've learned not to underestimate the chances of big companies ending up running scams either).

I've personally dealt mostly with the other end - the individuals and small agencies - and what I saw revealed total lack of necessary competences for the reports to be corresponding to reality. Perhaps it's understandable - after all, people who have the required knowledge likely end up working for big advertisers, or in entirely different fields. But small business owners don't pick these big advertising companies either.

Re:Uber discovered they’d been defrauded out of 2/3 of their... by srtjstjsj on Sunday January 03, 2021 @11:31PM (#25627946)
It would be fascinating if true if the big "brand name" companies whose entire business is based on charging more for the same commodity product as a generic store brand, but using advertising to justify the higher price in the customers' mind, weren't buying ads from people doing the same thing to them...

The question isn't are the scientists good, the question is if the vendor is honest.