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Re:Systems design explains the world: volume 1 by hliyan on Sunday December 27, 2020 @09:51PM (#25556259)
To me, this speaks to something entirely different: the idea that a complex system that works cannot be designed from the ground up, but must necessarily evolve from a simpler system that works.
Re:Systems design explains the world: volume 1 by Tommah on Sunday December 27, 2020 @11:20PM (#25556638)
Re:Systems design explains the world: volume 1 by qznc on Monday December 28, 2020 @06:23AM (#25558356)
There are examples of complex systems created in a short time:

1. Manhattan project: The Hiroshima bomb was only tested once. The Nagasaki bomb was a different kind and never tested in advance. The whole infrastructure to produce those bombs was created from scratch within three years.

2. ICMBs: It required to shrink down nuclear bombs to put them on rockets, develop the capability to steer rockets precisely enough over thousands of kilometer, create a whole industry around the manufacturing. Then scale it up to hundreds of rockets.

3. Put a man on the moon. Nobody died at the first attempt.

You could consider those three steps as an example of Gall's Law as they build on each other. However, I would say each of them is a complex system in itself.

Re:Systems design explains the world: volume 1 by beaconstudios on Monday December 28, 2020 @05:39PM (#25564101)
I would argue that none of these things are complex systems, in the systems theory sense. A complex system is typically comprised of a network of casual relationships so deeply interconnected that its behaviour is not easily reducible (in the scientific sense of isolating individual behaviours to be examined). Human designs intentionally avoid this and instead strive for mostly linear causality, precisely so we can test and develop individual parts in isolation.

For an example of a complex system (and how unintelligible they are), see this diagram of metabolic pathways in the human body: https://www.sigmaaldrich.com/content/dam/sigma-aldrich/artic...

Re:Systems design explains the world: volume 1 by HPsquared on Monday December 28, 2020 @07:40AM (#25558745)
It depends on the meaning of "from the ground up".
Re:Systems design explains the world: volume 1 by person_of_color on Monday December 28, 2020 @02:02AM (#25557344)
Is that how jets are designed?
Re:Systems design explains the world: volume 1 by hinoki on Monday December 28, 2020 @04:43AM (#25557950)
They don’t call the F-22 and F-35 fifth generation fighters for no reason. There have been many iterative improvements since the ME-262 and Gloster Meteor that would not have happened without the intermediate steps.
Re:Systems design explains the world: volume 1 by petrocrat on Monday December 28, 2020 @04:16AM (#25557833)
yes, jets are composed of thousands of components, each attached to each other in assemblies. The assemblies are then integrated in such a way as to perform the functions of a jet: providing thrust, providing lift, steering, holding fuel, etc.
Re:Systems design explains the world: volume 1 by HPsquared on Monday December 28, 2020 @07:41AM (#25558758)
Most of these systems are evolutions from previous designs, however. How much is completely new?