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Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by 1helloworld1 on Friday December 11, 2020 @04:36PM (#25391371)
Shouldn't the republican party be worried? If the trend continues and a lot of companies move from California to Texas bringing along a lot of liberal employees with them, won't that tip the already narrowing margin towards the democratic party?
Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by warmfuzzykitten on Friday December 11, 2020 @05:21PM (#25392186)
It won't be a problem for local republican politicians as long as people keep moving to already democratic locations like Austin, whose impact has already been gerrymandered away.

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/11/13/texas-redistricting-...

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by rayiner on Friday December 11, 2020 @05:34PM (#25392395)
Gerrymandering makes districts extremely sensitive to population changes. The country was heavily gerrymandered by Democrats until the 1990s, and Republicans managed to flip it around within the decade: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e6/Po...

The chart shows the House popular vote compared to the number of House seats. When Biden entered Congress, Democrats were winning 10 percentage points more of House seats than their share of the popular vote. But those districts were extremely sensitive to fluctuations and after redistricting based on the 1990 census many flipped rapidly.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by kevin_thibedeau on Friday December 11, 2020 @07:12PM (#25393573)
The Republican party was the party of the "wealthy elite" back then. They rebranded themselves as the standard bearer of Christian values to boost their voter base. Now their base is so hooked on this tribal identity they will vote for candidates whose behavior is antithetical to the stated party platform.
Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by rayiner on Friday December 11, 2020 @08:30PM (#25394306)
The Republican Party has been a fusion of business elite and evangelical Christians since its inception. The two groups not only broadly overlapped, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quakers, but both had adverse interests to the slaveholding south. The religious segment opposed slavery, and the business segment favored economic policies favorable to manufacturing industry (e.g. a strong currency, tariffs, and infrastructure) versus the weak currency and low tariffs favored by the agricultural south.

The strength of each faction waxes and wanes depending on what’s dividing the electorate. During the mid-20th century, both parties embraced “Christian values” (https://content.gallup.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Pro...) so economic issues dominated. Since Clinton, the parties are generally both on board with neo-liberalism, so religious and social issues dominate.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by disgruntledphd2 on Saturday December 12, 2020 @05:21AM (#25397272)
I really don't think that one can draw a line from the Quakers to the modern evangelical Christians. The Quakers were/are probably the closest Christian denomination to the actual lived beliefs expressed in the New Testament.

Maybe I just miss this, but that doesn't seem to match up with current evangelical support of the Republican party.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by jldugger on Friday December 11, 2020 @06:11PM (#25392894)
You can't gerrymander the senate though, and the 2020 election was 53-44.
Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by war1025 on Friday December 11, 2020 @04:47PM (#25391574)
Given that the parties are increasingly stratifying along class lines, and the working class is getting redder every year, I'd guess Hispanic immigration will trend in the Republicans favor and outpace upper-middle class migration from the coasts, which favors Democrats.

Of course that would require the Republicans to get out of their own way and stop playing into the Democrats' hand at every turn regarding Identity Politics. So who knows.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by chaostheory on Friday December 11, 2020 @05:05PM (#25391898)
> I'd guess Hispanic immigration will trend in the Republicans favor and outpace upper-middle class migration from the coasts, which favors Democrats.

This was the RNC's prediction and former goal for future growth. It was correct until Trump disrupted it. The only place where this is still true is in FL.

Until Trump loses his grip on the Republican party, Hispanics by and large will be flocking to the Democrats.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by war1025 on Friday December 11, 2020 @05:21PM (#25392201)
Trump increased his base with every ethnic group except Non-hispanic Whites this election, so I fail to see how that is accurate.
Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by chaostheory on Friday December 11, 2020 @05:50PM (#25392612)
Looking at the data, you're right.
Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by rayiner on Friday December 11, 2020 @05:28PM (#25392305)
Yes and no. It makes the electorate a bit more liberal but the Democratic Party more conservative. You saw this happening with the 2020 election. Flipping Georgia and Arizona is good in the sense you win, but now your tipping point voter is a Romney Republican in the Phoenix suburbs: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/11/gop-wom...
Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by hn_throwaway_99 on Friday December 11, 2020 @04:43PM (#25391479)
Maybe, but it's also a bit like Cubans in Florida, who tend to be quite conservative - they left Cuba because they didn't like the political situation there, similar to why a lot of Californians who move to TX are coming here.
Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by hintymad on Friday December 11, 2020 @08:19PM (#25394219)
I doubt it. It looks the people in IT who leave California for Texas are fiscally conservative but socially liberal, who traditionally vote democrats anyway.

Personally I don't see what's wrong with liberalism. What is wrong in the US is that the left prefer narratives over facts and data, and think that censorship would never one day hurt themselves.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by disown on Friday December 11, 2020 @11:03PM (#25395404)
> Shouldn't the republican party be worried? If the trend continues and a lot of companies move from California to Texas bringing along a lot of liberal employees with them, won't that tip the already narrowing margin towards the democratic party?

Shouldn't the democrats in california worry also? If so many democrats are moving to texas?

Oddly enough, just a few decades ago, texas used to be a democrat state and california was a republican state.

Lyndon B Johnson was a democrat from Texas and Richard Nixon was a republican from california.

I wonder if texas and california might flip in my lifetime. That would be so strange to see.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by SllX on Friday December 11, 2020 @04:56PM (#25391739)
That’s only a concern if the Republican Party makes no gains elsewhere, and Florida is looking less purple and more red these days, and the “blue wall” is looking a bit more purple.
Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by ntsplnkv2 on Friday December 11, 2020 @06:54PM (#25393395)
I'd caution making this conclusion.

Trump was a huge driver of turnout. I don't think the republican party is quite as strong without him on the ticket.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by SllX on Friday December 11, 2020 @09:35PM (#25394810)
Considering this was an almost surgical removal of an unpopular President without a total rejection of the President's party, I feel pretty confident in my statement, but who knows, anything can happen between now and 2022 and 2024. It certainly wasn't the blue wave anybody thought it would be this year, nor in 2018.

One thing I'm not holding my breath for in 2022 is seeing the Democrats in the House leverage their decreased majority into a larger majority, or even retaining the House considering mid-terms are always a bad time to be a member of the President's party. That, and after this past election there is a net increase in the number Republican trifecta States, an increase in the number of States under Republican Governors, and redistricting season will soon begin.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by ntsplnkv2 on Saturday December 12, 2020 @12:19AM (#25395803)
> unpopular President

Who set a record for votes. He wasn't unpopular, he was the 2nd most popular candidate ever.

People like to undersell how well the democrats did in 2018 and in 2020. Georgia going blue, Arizona going blue, and the blue wall getting rebuilt...it's pretty impressive. They kept the house, and may yet still win the senate.

The districts are already stacked against democrats as is. Republicans won't gain much from redistricting.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by SllX on Saturday December 12, 2020 @01:12AM (#25396035)
> Who set a record for votes. He wasn't unpopular, he was the 2nd most popular candidate ever.

You have a point, but let me ask you: if a bag of rice had been the Republican Presidential incumbent in place of Donald J. Trump, do you think Biden would have received a record-setting number of votes?

Maybe I'm wrong about this, but it seems to me Trump's unpopularity was as much a factor in Biden winning as anything else that, and maybe that's because I live in a blue bubble, but even conservative outlets I followed were expecting the Republicans to be absolutely crushed this election and to go down in flames with the President, and they weren't. Not even close. Republicans didn't regain the House, but they saw net gains, and they retained a full 50% of the Senate. Harris's vote is only relevant if the Democrats can win in the Georgia runoff on January 6th, not just one, but both seats, otherwise she's just another President of the Senate without a vote. Considering that election is still an open question, it is a bit early to be calling Georgia a blue state. Elections are more than just the President after all, and Red and Blue States are only really Red and Blue after they've demonstrated a continuous unbroken Red or Blue streak for a few cycles.

So again, if the Republican Presidential incumbent was a bag of rice, would we have 1. seen record-breaking turnout in favor of both candidates and 2. a loss by the incumbent? I ask, and maybe this is just because I live in a blue bubble inside a blue bubble, because it seems to me much of the public turned out to register a vote of no confidence in the President more than they turned out to vote specifically for Biden. I wouldn't say most of Biden's votes were this, but enough to swing the election in a few key States? I think that's plausible.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by ntsplnkv2 on Saturday December 12, 2020 @08:30AM (#25398120)
I think, by and large, you look at polls, and set your expectations. You say "I expected the republicans to be crushed, they weren't, so it must be true that the democrats didn't perform well." I think a lot of democrats did the same - but it wasn't truly realistic.

I'd say the republicans were beaten pretty badly. I think they are at their worst point in decades. They managed to get their largest turnout ever, and didn't even flip the house. States that were red for decades flipped blue. And if the two runoffs are losses, that is a devastating blow, losing all levels of the federal government. 50% is not 50% without the white house.

I don't think the memory of Trump will go away that quickly. This election mobilized a lot of young voters, and now that they've seen their vote got rid of him, they will be more motivated to vote again for more progressive agendas, or against more radical right wing ones.

I don't think the rural republicans (Which is really where trump got most of his boost, anyway), will come out the same for a Mitt Romney. They want the guy who isn't afraid to tell it "like it is", be anti-BLM, etc. That is a major rift in the republican party that will further impact who they put up as candidates - and more rejection from the suburbs and cities will come.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by SllX on Saturday December 12, 2020 @03:32PM (#25401437)
> I'd say the republicans were beaten pretty badly. I think they are at their worst point in decades.

Nah mate, I don't think so. 2008 was worse by far, I think you're reaching a little too hard for that one. If the Democrats had expanded their lead in the House, taken 60 Senate seats and expanded their hold on Governor's mansions, then this would be close to 2008, but even in that case Obama's margin of victory over McCain in both the Electoral College and the popular vote was a fair bit higher.

Yeah, the Republicans had their best turnout ever, but so did the Democrats! This was a record-turnout election all around. Turnout was so high that just a little less enthusiasm on one side or a little more animosity or apathy towards another side was enough to flip it around.

The only election in which the Republican Party was "destroyed" was the contest for the White House, and they saw some net losses in the Senate but not by anywhere close to the margin anyone thought. They actually gained in the House. 2008 this was not, not even close. Turnout was a lot higher, but the outcome is very different.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by icelancer on Friday December 11, 2020 @07:20PM (#25393637)
>> Trump was a huge driver of turnout. I don't think the republican party is quite as strong without him on the ticket.

Neither are the Democrats without a clear enemy. Many left-leaning people voted Biden as an anti-Trump vote.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by DoofusOfDeath on Friday December 11, 2020 @07:59PM (#25394007)
For anecdata, I'm right-leaning and I too voted for Biden because he isn't trump.
Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by stickyricky on Friday December 11, 2020 @04:45PM (#25391521)
(This is all conjecture) Whether or not Texas "purpled" because of Trump or population dynamics is an open question in my mind. I think a person's political identity is mostly environmental rather than principled. Yes there are some beliefs which are ingrained in us but mostly those beliefs don't enter into the political arena much.

Californians moving to Texas make it blue-er and themselves red-er. Who knows how this effects the electoral calculus into the future.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by dragonwriter on Friday December 11, 2020 @06:29PM (#25393103)
> Californians moving to Texas make it blue-er and themselves red-er.

That depends on the Californian. I don’t think Larry Ellison or Elon Musk moving to Texas make Texas bluer. It might make them redder though. Californians on average may be bluer than Texans, but the migration is a randomized sample of Californians.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by devmunchies on Friday December 11, 2020 @06:24PM (#25393050)
>Californians moving to Texas make it blue-er and themselves red-er.

Not if people are just sitting in their home all day. They won't be influenced by their environment but will still vote the same. Dockerized voters.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by rawgabbit on Saturday December 12, 2020 @11:15AM (#25399169)
Texan here. Yes and no. The three major Metro areas of Dallas Houston and Austin/San Antonio already are Democratic strongholds. The suburbs and rural areas vote Republican. The big issue here is the demographic growth of Hispanics. Both parties are trying to win their vote.
Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by adventured on Friday December 11, 2020 @05:32PM (#25392357)
> Shouldn't the republican party be worried?

There is no stopping Texas turning into a blue (Democrat) state. The demographic changes in the US guarantee that outcome under all scenarios, short of the Republican party rapidly becoming a split Hispanic party. It's the only sustainable path forward for that party, so we'll see if they adjust accordingly or increasingly weaken. The future of the US is Hispanic / Latin American, so either the Republicans will adapt or they'll lose the popular vote by ever greater margins.

Re:Oracle Moving HQ to Austin by selimthegrim on Friday December 11, 2020 @08:25PM (#25394264)
Tell that to the RGV Trump trains.