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Re:EU leaders agree to cut emissions by at least 55% by end ... by candu on Friday December 11, 2020 @08:36AM (#25385524)
Thanks for posting authoritative sources!

IMHO it's unfortunate when the kneejerk reaction to "governments / leaders do thing X" is "but did they think about obvious edge case Y!?"

Yes, they thought about obvious edge case Y; they employ / engage with loads of policy and domain experts for whom thinking about obvious edge case Y is table stakes, especially if Y is something one can think up off the cuff in a comment on HN. Perhaps not all of that thinking makes its way into final policies, whether for practical or political reasons. Perhaps much of that thinking - especially where nuance, expertise, or uncertainty are concerned - gets dropped from layperson reporting on the policy. Almost always, you can find publicly-available documents, transcripts, etc. that exhaustively list these details - all the arguments, all the community consultations, all the policy whitepapers.

These all exist, and unlike in modern academic publishing, you can almost always find and read them for free! That said, I do agree that we as a society need to put much more effort into accurate communication around expert fields. Specialization, and the resulting glut of information written for and consumed by specialized audiences, is one of many forces that make it harder to build a shared, agreed-upon sense of reality. What might it look like to solve this problem in the 21st century?

Re:EU leaders agree to cut emissions by at least 55% by end ... by hannob on Friday December 11, 2020 @02:34PM (#25389790)
I mean the thing is: This obvious edge case was there since the start of the european emission trading system - and it wasn't adressed for more than a decade.

It's good that they're finally working on it. But it's also something that should have happened a very long time ago.

Re:EU leaders agree to cut emissions by at least 55% by end ... by yostrovs on Friday December 11, 2020 @08:52AM (#25385683)
Perhaps your optimism about the diligence of politicians should meet the reality of history. Unintended consequences and people skirting the law are endemic to lawmaking.
Re:EU leaders agree to cut emissions by at least 55% by end ... by sgift on Friday December 11, 2020 @10:18AM (#25386680)
What's also endemic is people not bothering to participate in the lawmaking process and then throwing a tantrum that laws are bad.

If you don't bother and the other side does: guess whose suggestions end up in the law. Democracy is not a spectator sport. If you don't show up it has consequences.

Re:EU leaders agree to cut emissions by at least 55% by end ... by ploika on Friday December 11, 2020 @09:10AM (#25385927)
That's not very a sophisticated take to be honest, especially when we're talking about a part of the world that gave us the word "realpolitik". Politicians disappoint and unscrupulous people exploit. Absolutely everyone already knows that. It doesn't mean that nothing ever improves.
Re:EU leaders agree to cut emissions by at least 55% by end ... by candu on Monday December 14, 2020 @09:31AM (#25417941)
I don't have optimism about the diligence of politicians. I have optimism about (and direct experience with!) the diligence of the bureaucracy that advises those politicians, and that carries out the actual operation of policy, maintenance of infrastructure, etc.

The people you see on camera and in the news are a tiny, tiny slice of the operation of government. It is a grave misunderstanding of how society functions to equate "politicians" with "the government". This is true of any large system: a company is not its CEO, a non-profit is not its executive director, a program is not the interface it exposes to the outside world, and so on. In dealing with large systems, equating the part with the whole like this is effectively throwing away 99% of your power to understand and change those systems.

Re:EU leaders agree to cut emissions by at least 55% by end ... by multiplegeorges on Friday December 11, 2020 @12:53PM (#25388540)
Or perhaps we only hear about the failures because they make the news?

When a policy works, it's what is expected so it's not notable.