News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by Wowfunhappy on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @10:18PM (#25354942)
Does Matthew in accounting need access to the same network as the engineering staff?
Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by EvanAnderson on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @10:59PM (#25355170)
I can think of a few...

- The CFO doesn't understand why we need separate server infrastructure (and the associated licensing and maintenance costs) for accounting and engineering.

- Software vendors can't answer the most basic questions about how their software communicates to allow network ops to build reasonable access control lists for network segmentation.

- The network gear doesn't have sufficient horsepower to do wire-speed stateful packet filtering because, apparently, that's still an exciting new idea in 2020, and we can't slow everybody's access down.

- Individual departments have end-run IT by using "cloud" offerings that effectively bridge different segments of the network together at layer 7.

- Everybody has to be able to open their email and click random links on any PC.

Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by Silhouette on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @06:15AM (#25357452)
The network gear doesn't have sufficient horsepower to do wire-speed stateful packet filtering because, apparently, that's still an exciting new idea in 2020, and we can't slow everybody's access down.

The problem with any defence based on filtering is that first you have to decide what to filter. In an enterprise-scale network, this is not an easy problem, despite the number of shiny and expensive tools available that are selling the hope that it is.

Individual departments have end-run IT by using "cloud" offerings that effectively bridge different segments of the network together at layer 7.

This might be the most challenging problem for modern IT security, perhaps along with BYOD. The software and equipment accessible by staff might no longer be fully controlled by the organisation. That changes the emphasis for IT security from "just" securing your own software and systems to also somehow securing your data against unauthorised transfer to other systems. And this is a hugely complicated problem with (at least) technical, legal and management dimensions.

Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by smithza on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @10:41PM (#25355056)
Airgaps are certainly intended to protect against every skill level hacker. The ideal strategy is the multi-layered, Swiss cheese approach. A slice for RBAC (LDAP, AD, MFA, etc.); a slice for email phishing filters and user awareness training; another for network segmentation and isolation (Firewalls, proxies); another for network filters (ping DDOS attacks, etc.); and on and on. The APT attack strategy uses every tool in the arsenal and hunts for a path through the cheese layers, hopefully never finding one to the real prize behind.
Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by hangonhn on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @10:37PM (#25355034)
Air gap is not the final word in security. Stuxnet got into the Iranian centrifuges despite an air gap.
Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by Wowfunhappy on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @10:41PM (#25355059)
But only because someone plugged a USB drive into the centrifuge computers.

If the networks were air gapped, it wouldn't be Matthew's fault. Someone who had access to the engineering network would need to screw up. Which is of course perfectly possible—engineers make mistakes too. (Furthermore, if they were hacked by a nation state... for all we know it really could have been done without any user action at all.)

Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by stef25 on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @08:18AM (#25358143)
> But only because someone plugged a USB drive into the centrifuge computers.

Either that or one of the Siemens engineers who showed up at the plant's laptop was infected in anticipation of them showing up there to fix stuff.

Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by megous on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @11:18PM (#25355301)
Viruses spread quite fine without the help of any networking in the days of MS-DOS.
Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by est31 on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @10:51PM (#25355117)
Likely you want to transfer data from an airgapped computer and back. So you need some way of transferring it.
Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by Wowfunhappy on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @11:12PM (#25355261)
It’s not obvious to me why engineering and accounting should need to transfer any data and back forth beyond basic email communications.
Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by est31 on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @02:07AM (#25356101)
Email seems simple to you, but in fact it's an incredibly complicated protocol, so software treating it is likely to have many (exploitable) bugs. Also, there are attachments. Those are the classical way to hack many places.

Even if you got all of the issues caused by e-mails figured out, somehow you have to transfer them from one network to another. You'll either have to poke holes into your firewall or use USB sticks.

My point is: even in airgapped networks you usually want to exchange some data. The moment you want to exchange data, you have a path where a virus can be smuggled in.

Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by pjc50 on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @03:02AM (#25356395)
Single sign on etc: usually there's a resource that everyone in the company needs to use. Besides, email is a major infection vector.
Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by hangonhn on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @11:54PM (#25355505)
I mean email is a vector too. And remember that 0 day no touch iOS exploit that was discovered by project zero? Surely that could have been vector too. After that use a compromised iOS device to do something similar by exploiting some bluetooth vulnerability.
Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by yodelshady on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @07:52AM (#25357975)
If we only have a single example of their defeat in the last more than a decade, I'd say that's evidence they're a pretty good word.

What other security features claim that performance?

Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by zbentley on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @08:58AM (#25358460)
I'd argue that many/most instances of the "dropped USB stick in parking lot" infiltration technique are also failings of airgapping as a total security measure.
Re:FireEye Shares Details of Recent Cyber Attack by spullara on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @11:00PM (#25355175)
Pretty irrelevant. They can get money from Matthew over the phone or even snail mail without ever using a computer.