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Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by raverbashing on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @07:02AM (#25344158)
This is missing the point and reeks of intellectual dishonesty.

Asymptomatic has a strict definition. You get the virus and nothing happens to you. This is what the WHO and Fauci are referring to.

But most "asymptomatic" cases aren't. They are either paucisymptomatic (you have mild symptoms - maybe too mild to notice) or pre-symptomatic.

Obviously if people were only contagious if showing symptoms, the pandemic wouldn't be.

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by Wintamute on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @07:27AM (#25344310)
I made a new point, so am I missing my own point? Confused.

> Obviously if people were only contagious if showing symptoms, the pandemic wouldn't be.

I don't think that is obviously the case at all. It would have to be proved. The dominant vectors of contagion are not yet well understood - we could be dealing with very highly infectious airborne virus, that is capable of spreading widely from a relatively small number of symptomatic and pre-symptomatic super spreaders.

The fact remains that current public health interventions orientate around isolating individuals whether they are symptomatic, asymptomatic or paucisymptomatic. Moreover, to greater and lesser degrees we also isolate the healthy, assuming them to be asymptomatic in an abundance of caution. Considering the negative non-covid related knock on effects of these policies its at least worth investigating isn't it?

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by raverbashing on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @08:05AM (#25344551)
> we could be dealing with very highly infectious airborne virus, that is capable of spreading widely from a relatively small number of symptomatic and pre-symptomatic super spreaders.

The calculated R0 does not support this theory. Measles works this way. R0 for Measles is > 10

> that current public health interventions orientate around isolating individuals whether they are symptomatic, asymptomatic or paucisymptomatic

Everywhere, the restrictions are higher if you were tested and/or is suspected of having Covid. Of course a lot of people DNGAF about the restrictions, which is part of the problem.

Again, if your theory that people showing no symptoms do not transmit the disease then it should be super easy to go around and start finding people spreading it. But it isn.t

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by tialaramex on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @07:24AM (#25344285)
I followed the New Zealand press conferences very closely and so often the initial story was this person had no symptoms, total surprise to them that they had the virus, and then a day later oh, well, actually they did have some symptoms but they didn't realise it was COVID-19...

People will say to themselves well, it's just a cough right? Just a cough. I can't have COVID-19 that's something other people get, those people are sick but I'm healthy, this is just a cough. And that allows the virus to spread.

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by tzs on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @07:41AM (#25344394)
> They are either paucisymptomatic (you have mild symptoms - maybe too mild to notice)

Or you notice them but because they also match symptoms of colds and allergies, and you’ve been getting them on and off for months, you assume they aren’t COVID.

I don’t think there has been an interval longer than a week since February during which I didn’t have at least a couple symptoms that could have been COVID.

I’ve not had the taste/smell loss, and all my contact with other people has been masked and brief, and I’m in an area where spread has been low, so I’ve probably not had it, but I wish we had widespread cheap testing so I could know.

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by tomp on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @09:43AM (#25345752)
> Or you notice them but because they also match symptoms of colds and allergies, and you’ve been getting them on and off for months, you assume they aren’t COVID.

Exactly. I have occasionally runny nose combined with sporadic sneezes and coughs pretty much every winter. If someone like my had so "mild" COVID symptoms they would consider themselves asymptomatic (paucisymptomatic?), and rightfully so. (My actual COVID symptoms were not as mild, but not very serious either.)

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by Wintamute on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @07:44AM (#25344411)
> I don’t think there has been an interval longer than a week since February during which I didn’t have at least a couple symptoms that could have been COVID.

It's remarkable the number of people anecdotally reporting similar symptoms - often out of character for otherwise robustly healthy individuals. I'm guessing some sort of psychosomatic response to the year's stresses.

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by cassianoleal on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @07:58AM (#25344509)
Is it that out of character though?

I have been having the same, but the main reason why I notice it now is that every time I have any symptom, even the mildest of them, I take notice and consider the possibility of Covid, whereas in past years I would forget about them if even notice at all.

For context, I'm a fairly healthy individual who hasn't seen a GP or other medical doctor in at least a couple years, probably longer. Last time I've been to one was because of exercise-related injuries.

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by Wintamute on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @08:44AM (#25344889)
> every time I have any symptom, even the mildest of them, I take notice and consider the possibility of Covid

This is hypochondria isn't it? A pathology in its own right, no doubt caused by current events.

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by cassianoleal on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @01:11PM (#25349149)
Of course it isn't. I don't even bother about mild symptoms, much less go see a doctor or look for a cure. I just take note.

It's not hypochondria, it's simple awareness.

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by raverbashing on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @07:46AM (#25344427)
Oh I totally understand you

That being said it seems the most specific symptom is loss of smell/taste so unless you have that it's probably something else (disclaimer: not a doctor and this is not medical advice)

Re:First person receives Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine in UK by doliveira on Tuesday December 08, 2020 @07:26AM (#25344297)
12 months in, I'd say we can already claim it more than "reeks": it is full-blown intellectual dishonesty. Viral load peeks before symptoms onset, we have quite a few case studies of transmission, but these people apparently want some dozens of RCTs before admitting it.