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Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by Upvoter33 on Monday November 09, 2020 @07:56AM (#25034246)
Are you serious?
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by Frost1x on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:40AM (#25034675)
I mean, to be fair, the timing is interesting but I wouldn't go any further than that.

I don't think (and find it incredibly unlikely) there's any correlation per se, but quite a few people were hoping to hear certain news on the political front and the COVID front. They heard both in a pretty short window and I'd say that and the effects nationally are interesting.

Many many people are now feeling a lot of stress relief in a short period of time. Should be interesting how this effects morale around the country.

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by woofie11 on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:07AM (#25034370)
This is exactly the point of preregistered hypotheses.

Odds of conspiracy, with a clear hypothesis and confirmation of that hypothesis, go up drastically. That happened here.

It wasn't a super-unlikely hypothesis either. We're talking about announcing a result a few weeks earlier versus later. That's not an unreasonable decision for a blue-leaning businessperson or scientist to make.

What reduces odds are the number of preregistrations. There were dozens about this strong.

My own prior went from 1% odds to maybe 35% odds. Yours may be different, likely based on your prior based on where you fall on the political spectrum. Right-wingers will probably go 35% to 80%, and left-wingers from 0.01% to 1%.

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by adamsea on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:45AM (#25034714)
> That's not an unreasonable decision for a blue-leaning businessperson or scientist to make.

I just want to make the obligatory point that the way the Trump administration has handled the Covid response in the US goes beyond red and blue ...

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by adamsea on Tuesday November 17, 2020 @11:23PM (#25133193)
Do any down voters want to step up and say they think the Trump Administration has competently handled the pandemic?

It's obvious to anyone willing to look at the facts, and to be honest with themselves, that this administration has done a terrible, terrible job of responding to the pandemic which has probably caused the unnecessary deaths of a lot of people.

And that's not a partisan thing to say. Or rather, it shouldn't be ...

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by cryptoz on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:25AM (#25034512)
> That's not an unreasonable decision for a blue-leaning businessperson or scientist to make.

Intentionally murdering possibly thousands of people (or tens of thousands? or what, who knows?!) for some assumed political gain is absolutely, 100% an unreasonable decision for any human to make. Intentionally delaying a vaccine would certainly be a crime, no? Not to mention absolutely abhorrent and completely evil.

That is not a "reasonable decision" to make by any stretch of the imagination.

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by Jedd on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:38AM (#25034659)
You seem to be jumping to an awful lot of conclusions without really explaining what you understand is happening here.

(I note that I don't understand at all what you're asserting.)

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by gscho on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:36AM (#25034640)
> Intentionally murdering possibly thousands of people (or tens of thousands? or what, who knows?!) for some assumed political gain is absolutely, 100% an unreasonable decision for any human to make. Intentionally delaying a vaccine would certainly be a crime, no? Not to mention absolutely abhorrent and completely evil.

You mean delaying the announcement of a vaccine. They didn't delay the process.

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by woofie11 on Monday November 09, 2020 @07:17PM (#25041557)
No. I didn't write "Intentionally murdering possibly thousands of people" or "Intentionally delaying a vaccine"

I wrote "We're talking about announcing a result a few weeks earlier versus later."

And if that was the goal, I think it worked. It looks like Biden won by literally tens of thousands votes. An announcement a week earlier probably would have swung the election to Trump.

At a cost of zero lives.

If the vaccine works as announced, we're still weeks away from the end of the trial, and months away from widespread distribution.

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by colaclanth on Monday November 09, 2020 @07:51AM (#25034204)
what are you insinuating here?
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by camhart on Monday November 09, 2020 @07:57AM (#25034266)
That the timing of the press release is interesting... first business day after the election is called.

Massive corporations do have political agendas. I don't think anyone would argue they don't. But maybe it's just coincidence?

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by rsynnott on Monday November 09, 2020 @09:34AM (#25035196)
In your conspiracy theory, surely, they'd just have announced after polls closed? Why wait for it to be called? Also, this vaccine was actually developed by a German company, who would likely resent their partner playing this game.

This timing is consistent with when we've been told we might see early results all along, really; it shouldn't be that surprising. Expect announcements from other teams over the next couple of months.

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by dEnigma on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:45AM (#25034711)
First business day after the election was called, but not after the election itself (i.e. people couldn't vote after 11/02). Or are you saying that they were planning on not releasing this at all in case of a Trump win and not just trying to influence the election?
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by camhart on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:55AM (#25034814)
The thought didn't even cross my mind that they'd hold the vaccine for political reasons. Just the press release. Holding the vaccine itself for political reasons would be murder on a mass scale.
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by sergiotapia on Monday November 09, 2020 @07:55AM (#25034236)
He's just saying the timing is impeccable.
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by aceon48 on Monday November 09, 2020 @07:55AM (#25034243)
That cvoid will dissappear after the election. pfizer clearly had this data earlier and held it until after election
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by vertis on Monday November 09, 2020 @07:57AM (#25034263)
Citation needed.
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by zaroth on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:22AM (#25034485)
No, there is no citation needed. They didn’t discover this data all in the last week.

There is some incremental work that was done toward confirming this result and typing this press release in the last week.

It’s not like they waited till last week to collect the data. They have ongoing surveillance of their entire study population.

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by rpedela on Monday November 09, 2020 @10:19AM (#25035625)
In a double-blind, phase 3 trial only one group has on-going data access: the independent group conducting the study. No one else, including patients, doctors, and the business, has any knowledge of the results until they are "unsealed". That continues to be true throughout the entire trial even if preliminary results are unsealed at different points.
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by zaroth on Monday November 09, 2020 @11:15AM (#25036280)
Precisely. They have seen 94 infections total so far, based on the statistics that’s likely to be almost entirely in the control group. Those infections are reported as they come in, so for example, perhaps last week there were 87 infections. The study ends once they hit ~150 infections, based on their sample size that will give them the confidence intervals they need to finalize.

So the difference between announcing preliminary results last week versus this week was their own internal decision on timing.

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by biopoliticssuck on Monday November 09, 2020 @01:57PM (#25038282)
They did wait until last week to collect the data. Wednesday, in fact.
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by zaroth on Monday November 09, 2020 @06:07PM (#25041079)
They intentionally kept the samples frozen in their lab until the day after the election. The most important vaccine in the 21st century, and they kept the samples on ice? That's incredible.
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by zaroth on Monday November 09, 2020 @12:02PM (#25036857)
Ok, I have to partially take that back. According the Pfizer they intentionally did not confirm the data until last Wednesday.

> The first analysis was to occur after 32 volunteers — both those who received the vaccine and those on placebo — had contracted Covid-19. If fewer than six volunteers in the group who received the vaccine had developed Covid-19, the companies would make an announcement that the vaccine appeared to be effective. The study would continue until at least 164 cases of Covid-19 — individuals with at least one symptom and a positive test result — had been reported.

> In their announcement of the results, Pfizer and BioNTech revealed a surprise. The companies said they had decided not to conduct the 32-case analysis “after a discussion with the FDA.” Instead, they planned to conduct the analysis after 62 cases. But by the time the plan had been formalized, there had been 94 cases of Covid-19 in the study. It’s not known how many were in the vaccine arm, but it would have to be nine or fewer.

> Gruber said that Pfizer and BioNTech had decided in late October that they wanted to drop the 32-case interim analysis. At that time, the companies decided to stop having their lab confirm cases of Covid-19 in the study, instead leaving samples in storage. The FDA was aware of this decision. Discussions between the agency and the companies concluded, and testing began this past Wednesday. When the samples were tested, there were 94 cases of Covid in the trial. The DSMB met on Sunday.

Discussions between the agency and the companies concluded, and testing began this past Wednesday.

https://www.statnews.com/2020/11/09/covid-19-vaccine-from-pf...

Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by rangoon626 on Monday November 09, 2020 @07:15PM (#25041541)
They could not have released it. Coronavirus was like 80% the democrats platform. Without that, they truly had nothing.
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Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by vertis on Monday November 09, 2020 @07:56AM (#25034253)
I'm offering a complete aluminum body suits for $5000/each. Covers when they aim the signals upwards to catch the people only wearing foil hats. ^_^
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by GhostVII on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:02AM (#25034310)
I don't think it's totally unbelievable that they waited until after the election to release preliminary results. Waiting a week or two wouldn't hurt the timeline, and would significantly damage Trump's campaign. If I worked at Pfizer that's what I would do.
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by yokaze on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:43AM (#25034696)
At the risk of damaging Pfizers bottom-line, if someone manages to produce results before them, and at the risk of getting fired and sued for doing so.
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by IgorPartola on Tuesday November 10, 2020 @06:11PM (#25053344)
The protocol was to release the results when enough people got sick. You can’t control when hat happens.
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by bluGill on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:36AM (#25034632)
It is - even if the company is 90% blue, that is still 10% that is red and will ensure this leaks early.
Re:Covid vaccine: First ‘milestone’ vaccine offers 90% prote... by SpicyLemonZest on Monday November 09, 2020 @08:23AM (#25034495)
It’s just such a fundamentally bizarre idea that I think it needs a lot more support than just “not totally unbelievable”. Most people don’t warp all their decisions around partisan politics.