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Re:Why American cities can’t keep up with infrastructure mai... by WalterBright on Sunday October 04, 2020 @07:07PM (#24682969)
> The classic example is Enron.

Enron went to zero after their fraud went public.

> Unsustainable practices eventually have their reckoning regardless if they are public or private.

The looming crisis of local government is known, but nobody does a thing about it. Unlike with stocks.

> Public checks are at the voting booth, private (publicly traded) companies checks are at the stock exchange.

There's a huge difference. To change things in government requires a 51% majority vote once every several years. But if you don't like a stock, you can sell it in a millisecond (literally). You don't have to convince anyone else. A vote is not the same thing as a choice.

Re:Why American cities can’t keep up with infrastructure mai... by bumby on Sunday October 04, 2020 @08:42PM (#24683511)
>Enron went to zero after their fraud went public.

And when governments become irrevocably insolvent, they fail (as does their fiat currency). It's still very much the same principle just at a more grand scale. Your claim that accounting transparency fixes the issue in private companies is undercut by the fact that the accounting firm Arthur Andersen was essentially defunct because of fraud in the Enron scandal. The watchers weren't doing their job ethically.

>The looming crisis of local government is known, but nobody does a thing about it. Unlike with stocks.

I disagree. You speak as if everyone is on the same page but that's not the case. Take social security in the U.S. as an example. Some will say it's a completely broken system and needs to be done away with. Others think it's solvent by simply modifying the tax base, or by raising the entitlement age, or any combination of factors. The same goes with stocks; sides will argue about whether a specific strategy or earnings result is a death knell or a temporary inconvenience until everybody can finally agree. Both scenarios are systems of human convention and thus solvable by modifying those conventions. Public pensions will follow suit just like private company pensions; when the burden gets too big to bear, the convention will be modified. Some civil servants will be on the short end of the stick, or tax-payers will be overly burdened, or something in between because it's totally a problem of human creation and not beholden to natural laws that can be bent. I've literally witnessed this happen both in private company and public pensions. When tax-payers start to disagree with policies en masse, they can elect the right politicians to fix it. If that's not happening, apparently enough people don't feel it's enough of a problem.

>You don't have to convince anyone else

You absolutely have to find a buyer at the level you want to get out at. Just because the system is fast and automated doesn't mean you can act as a single party. A vote is certainly different because it has the nuances of living in a society (so you can't just get your way because you decided it), but that doesn't negate the intended point that the root of short-term thinking is in human psychology, not the nature of an organization being public or private.

Re:Why American cities can’t keep up with infrastructure mai... by WalterBright on Monday October 05, 2020 @06:00AM (#24686183)
> You absolutely have to find a buyer at the level you want to get out at.

If you want to equate that to needing to convince 51% of the voters, I'll leave the field.

Re:Why American cities can’t keep up with infrastructure mai... by bumby on Monday October 05, 2020 @07:01AM (#24686493)
I’m not equating the two. I’m getting the impression that you’re drawing false equivalencies and missing the broader point that it’s not a public vs private problem but a human psychology problem as evidenced by the fact it exists in both arenas. I’ve literally said from the onset that while it exists in both, each system is different in terms of scale and correction mechanism. In other words, I admit they are not equal in manifestation while thinking they share the same underlying cause rooted in human nature.