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A comment on A Horrible Experiment.

Re:A Horrible Experiment by noxer on Sunday September 20, 2020 @10:23AM (#24534224)
The real problem I see here is the default assumption from many people that these is racial bias in the algorithm with no evidence thereof whatsoever. Thats how twitter works, shitstorm first, research later, evidence or corrections for false assumptions - never.
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Re:A Horrible Experiment by svrb on Sunday September 20, 2020 @10:30AM (#24534261)
It's also how HN works. In a comment far below there's a link to a decent controlled experiment completely debunking this claim (outcome using controlled dataset: 40 white to 52 black faces chosen). But that comment is heavily downvoted.

https://twitter.com/vinayprabhu/status/1307497736191635458?s...

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Re:A Horrible Experiment by acqq on Sunday September 20, 2020 @11:57AM (#24534698)
> (outcome using controlled dataset: 40 white to 52 black faces chosen). But that comment is heavily downvoted.

Maybe because

1) If that's the comment you refer to, it also contains the claim "Misleading - it seems to be looking for contrast" which as far as I see isn't provably true?

2) in the end tweet of the experiment it's claimed: "I've created @cropping_bias to run the complete the experiment. Waiting for @Twitter to approve Dev credentials" and the https://twitter.com/cropping_bias is still empty at the moment?

Edit: personally, the interesting experiments for me are like "a person against a drawing" -- the simpler the competition is the bigger the chance to figure out what the "preference" could be:

https://mobile.twitter.com/griffonatrix/status/1307463528337...

(Luckily, I don't depend on Twitter, but I'd suggest that those who do should have the chance to do the "manual override.")

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Re:A Horrible Experiment by noxer on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:08PM (#24534779)
He wants to collect more data. But current limited data shows no bias toward images from people with light skin tones.
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Re:A Horrible Experiment by noxer on Sunday September 20, 2020 @10:40AM (#24534319)
People want it to be true. Instead they should want to know if its true.
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Re:A Horrible Experiment by svrb on Sunday September 20, 2020 @02:21PM (#24536011)
> People want it to be true.

This is the really disturbing thing. Why would someone want Twitter to have race-based image cropping? And yet the behavior of many in the various threads is precisely as if they did! I think it may actually make them happier if it's true. Who are the real racists, again? It's hard to tell sometimes.

And after all, doesn't the Twitter OP acknowledge this inevitable result when calling it a "horrible" experiment?

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Re:A Horrible Experiment by noxer on Sunday September 20, 2020 @03:15PM (#24536531)
>Why would someone want Twitter to have race-based image cropping?

-Victim mentality -Virtue signaling -Having a "proof" for a common enemy (twitter, social media , big evil corp etc. etc.)

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Re:A Horrible Experiment by Lammy on Sunday September 20, 2020 @10:49AM (#24534367)
People want to be able to believe in a truth they are told rather than have to have the responsibility of observing their own at all times. People have been wired so strongly for this that they will even downvote you when you remind them of it :)
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Re:A Horrible Experiment by matthewmacleod on Sunday September 20, 2020 @10:30AM (#24534257)
I mean “no evidence whatsoever” is a pretty big stretch. There’s the initial example, a bunch of other examples of the same effect posted in the thread, and it’s already a really well-known and obvious effect that we have seen occur many times before.
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Re:A Horrible Experiment by noxer on Sunday September 20, 2020 @10:39AM (#24534311)
That called "anecdotal" not an evidence.
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Re:A Horrible Experiment by odonnellryan on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:03PM (#24534740)
Anecdotal evidence is still evidence. These are not anecdotes however, but probably not very significant.
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Re:A Horrible Experiment by noxer on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:12PM (#24534813)
lok what. "Anecdotal evidence" specifically described a false evidence. Just because "evidence" is part of the term doesn't mean it a valid evidence.
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Re:A Horrible Experiment by 411111111111111 on Sunday September 20, 2020 @12:30PM (#24534941)
That's incorrect. Anecdotes aren't necessarily wrong/incorrect. They're just Stories which may or may not be coincidences, falsehoods or representative of the reality.

An anecdote is just a single data point, so no conclusion can be drawn from it alone

Its true that it's often used to discredit someone, often even in bad faith... But that doesn't mean that it's inherintly derogatory

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Re:A Horrible Experiment by noxer on Sunday September 20, 2020 @03:06PM (#24536447)
I never said the anecdotal evidence is "wrong" I said its a "false evidence" the conclusion can still be correct. The evidence remains false/not valid if it is anecdotal.
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Re:A Horrible Experiment by odonnellryan on Friday October 02, 2020 @10:37AM (#24663045)
Anecdotal evidence is not false evidence. Evidence based on individual experiences or observations is not "false" but it can be subjective and misleading. It is still used all the time in law.
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