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Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by AnthonyMouse on Sunday September 13, 2020 @09:41PM (#24465837)
> The perpetual architecture license folks that make their own cores like Apple, Samsung, Qualcomm, and Fujitsu (I think they needed this for the A64FX, right?) will be fine

There is one thing they would need to worry about though, which is that if the rest of the market moves to RISC-V or x64 or whatever else, it's not implausible that someone might at some point make a processor which is superior to the ones those companies make in-house. If it's the same architecture, you just buy them or license the design and put them in your devices. If it's not, you're stuck between suffering an architecture transition that your competitors have already put behind them or sticking with your uncompetitive in-house designs using the old architecture that nobody else wants anymore.

Their best move might be to forget about the architecture license and make the switch to something else with the rest of the market.

Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by zdw on Sunday September 13, 2020 @11:54PM (#24466602)
> Their best move might be to forget about the architecture license and make the switch to something else with the rest of the market.

This assumes that there isn't some other factor in transitioning architecture - this argument could boil down in the mid 2000's to "Why not go x86/amd64", but you couldn't buy a license to that easily (would need to be 3-way with Intel/AMD to further complicate things)

Apple has done quite well with their ARM license, outperforming the rest of the mobile form factor CPU market by a considerable margin. I don't doubt that they could transition - they've done it successfully 3 times already, even before the current ARM transition.

Apple under Cook has said they want to "to own and control the primary technologies behind the products we make". I doubt they'd turn away from that now to become dependent on an outside technology, especially given how deep their pockets are.

Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by thomasjudge on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:46AM (#24470767)
It's kind of puzzling that Apple didn't buy them. They don't seem to be particularly aggressive/creative in the M&A department
Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by ed25519FUUU on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:52PM (#24477455)
They have a perpetual license. What value is it for them to buy ARM?
Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by ineedasername on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:39PM (#24477379)
Many of Apple's direct competitors are ARM customers, and US politics is already turning a large anti-trust eye towards FAANG. That might have been a factor.
Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by andoriyu on Monday September 14, 2020 @01:49PM (#24472990)
Apple buying arm would never get approved. They have way to many direct competitors that heavily rely on SoCs that has arm cores.
Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by fluffything on Monday September 14, 2020 @05:58AM (#24468459)
Apple could transition in 10 years to RISC-V, just like how they transitioned 10 years ago to x86, 10 years before to PPC, 10 years before to .........
Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by spullara on Monday September 14, 2020 @12:11AM (#24466678)
They did dump ZFS when they decided they didn't like the licensing terms.
Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by AnthonyMouse on Monday September 14, 2020 @08:03PM (#24476535)
> Apple has done quite well with their ARM license, outperforming the rest of the mobile form factor CPU market by a considerable margin.

But that has really nothing to do with the architecture. They just spent more money on CPU R&D than their ARM competitors. They could have done the same thing with RISC-V, and if that's where the rest of the industry is going, they could be better off going there too. Especially for Mac, since they're about to do a transition anyway. They could benefit from putting it off for another year while they change the target architecture to something the rest of the market might not be expected to avoid in the future.

There is also no guarantee that their success is permanent. They might have done a better job than Qualcomm this year, but what happens tomorrow, if Google throws their hat into the ring, or AMD makes a strong play for the mobile market, or Intel gets their heads out of their butts, or China decides they want the crown and gives a design team an unlimited budget? There is value in the ability to switch easily in the event that someone else is the king of the mountain for a while.

> I don't doubt that they could transition - they've done it successfully 3 times already, even before the current ARM transition.

Just because they can do it doesn't mean it's free.

Really if Intel was shrewd, they'd recognize that they've lost Apple's business already and just sell them an x86 license, under some terms that Intel would care about and Apple wouldn't, like they can only put the chips in their own devices. Then Apple could save themselves the transition entirely and do another refresh with processors from Intel while they put their CPU team to task redesigning their own chips to be x86_64. It would give both Apple and Intel a chance to throw a punch at Nvidia (which neither of them like) while helping both of them. Apple by avoiding the Mac transition cost and Intel by maintaining the market share of their processor architecture and earning them whatever money they get from Apple for the license.

And it gives Intel a chance to win Apple's business back. All they have to do is design a better CPU than Apple does in-house, and Apple could start shipping them again without having to switch architectures. Which is also of value to Apple because it allows them to do just that if Intel does produce a better CPU than they do at any point in the future.

Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by ed25519FUUU on Monday September 14, 2020 @10:55PM (#24477470)
The problem I see with your argument is that it ignores their superior mobile ARM SoC. If they are going to unify on an architecture, it would certainly be easier to migrate Mac to ARM than iOS to x86.
Re:Nvidia to Acquire Arm for $40B by AnthonyMouse on Wednesday September 16, 2020 @05:23AM (#24490951)
Your assumption is that the architecture matters and they couldn't build an x86 SoC which is just as good, but they could.

And you don't want to move to ARM if everybody else is moving away from it.